blue atlas cedar

Also John, When you re-pot don't root pruned to much of the root ball. Blue atlas don't like it when you take to much off and they do like to go in a larger pot.

A Hui Hou,
-Tim

moyogijohn wrote:This is the cedar that I have posted on questions forum. Any advice would be helpful.
Thank you so much!
John

Hi John

This is a very similar tree, but with a slightly raised lower branch to the right - to add some character (IMHO;-)) This christmas (2010) the Atlas cedar was the top of pops in contemporay christmas tree fashion in Denmark. I got it from a neighbour after it had served it's purpose. It will need years of training and pruning as the tree grows denser, however it might serve as inspiration for your tree, rather than me attempting to give any good advice. I didn't touch the smallest twigs. It looks a bit busy, but I wanted to let the tree grow a bit more and later on I might turn the twigs into jinns or remove them completely. I too would like a comment.... hell I would even love to see a virtual made by Dorothy or somebody as clever with a mouse-click ;-)

Loke Emil,,,Your tree looks a lot like the one i HAD....BE VERY CAREFUL..how you start your workwith this one...there are some really nice cedars bonsaied..let some one expline how you go about pruning roots...everyone tried to help me but i failedwith this one...make it work ok??? take care john

moyogijohn wrote:Loke Emil,,,Your tree looks a lot like the one i HAD....BE VERY CAREFUL..how you start your workwith this one...there are some really nice cedars bonsaied..let some one expline how you go about pruning roots...everyone tried to help me but i failedwith this one...make it work ok??? take care john

Dear John

feel absolutely free to describe your working proces and it's unintended failiures. It might help my tree survive ;-)

I understand that the cedar tree doesn't like hard root pruning, thrives in rather large pots during the growing years as a pre bonsai. I also learned that the cedar takes well to wiring. Repotting this species is something people disagree on, from what I understand: some say repot during the hottest weeks of the year, others say before new growth hardens etc.

I welcome any experienced knowledge towards bonsaiing this species ;-)

Sorry your cedar suffered the unexpected death?? why did the roots die? ...perhabs forumites would elaborate a bit more on this species?

Loke Emil,,,Thanks for your reply...what i did was what i was told not too do,,,I pruned the roots too much,,in a hurry to make them small..too much water by misting the foliage because the foliage started turning brown... Just go slow and look on the internet for pictures of cedars bonsaied...listen to what these great people tell you!!!!! take care john

Don't root prune your cedar during the cold months they hate it, if I were you I would wait until june or july(assuming you live in the northern hemisphere) when the weather is consistently warm and the night temps have come up. And don't root prune when they have soft growth you need to do it after the new growth has hardened off.
Craigw

Hi Craigw

a 1000thanks for the advise :-)

John, go get another cedar and let us embark on a great cedar ventue together here in this thread. I don't mean to highjack the thread, but it seems like the cedar is a much appreciated species, though hard to succeed with - thus dismissed as a great bonsai species. I love it - for it's color and accessability as a nursery stock material - and I certainly will try to make it with this one. Are you game ;-) ?

I don't like to consider a rootball as a ball, especially when prunning a container grown tree - I try to treat each rootbranch as a part of a whole. So rootpruning is never just a matter of pruning halfs, thirds, fifths etc.

Everyone! How well does a cedar respond to removíng, say, a tap root? Little by little or all in one? with cutting paste or left bare? Does a rooting hormone (powder) help new feeder roots butting on the cedar? And while I'm at it: soilmixes for this species? which is the best soil as a growing medium for a pre bonsai? And is it adviseable to completely clean the cedar roots from the container soil?

Craigw! You say repot on the hottest day of the summer: how would a greenhouse with a heatbed do for an earlyer first repotting in the spring (reaching summer night temps)? Same-same or?!
Again, any experienced comments are most welcome ;-)

I have never grown my cedars in a hot house or with bottom heat so I can't really comment on that. I repot my trees when the day time temps are around the 30-35 degree mark and the night temps would be around 15-20 degrees.
They are quite a popular species here in south eastern Australia and I have seen a wonderful old tree at the national collection in Washington. I had an old friend (now deceased) who loved them and grew lots of them. He used to develop his cedars in poly-boxes and during the growing season literally mulched them with chicken manure pellets, they grew like rockets. I use a very free draining mix, diatomite and rotted pine bark very throughly sieved to remove all the fines.
Craigw

When people hear the name cedar, they think of a tree from high cool mountains, like the Cedar of Lebanon. But remember that Cedrus atlantica is from the Atlas Mountains of North Africa. It is not surprising that it likes to be repotted in midsummer. Even less surprising when you realize that many of us learned the hard way that even mugo pines in some climates like to be repotted in midsummer, which makes no logical sense at all.
Iris

Hi All

First post here after struggling for a week to register, seemingly this forum doesn't like Yahoo addresses, by GMail is fine.

I planted some atlas cedar seed two weeks ago, I'd never seen one before but I fell in love with the one standing in the Kirstenbosch Gardens in Cape Town (SA) while on holiday.

I am severely jealous of what you can buy in nurseries , but I'm also very happy that (hopefully) I'll have some seedlings in the near future.

Thanks for that advice, I'm years away from being able to use it, but hopefully it gets stuck somewhere in my brain.

Greets

Gerhard

Welcome Gerhard and we're glad you persevered with the registering proccess.

Hopefull your new snippet of info will come in handy in the future. As they say, no knowledge is ever wasted.

I cannot figure out how to place a photo in this post, so here is a link to a photo of my Blue Atlas Cedar. I have had it for about 15 years.

Keeping these trees happy is very difficult. They do like repotting in warm weather, but my preference is to do it during a spring heat wave (we get them here in California). Free draining soil is a must. They will tolerate a lot of fertilizer during the growing season, but their growth cycle is very short. In late spring they will throw out new growth -- shoots four or five nodes long if they are happy, and a replacement set of needles if they just barely like you. After that, they are done for the year.

They are not apically dominant. They like to throw growth on the lower branches and die back at the apex, so if you see one with a really full apex, the grower is some kind of bonsai magician.

In order to make repotting work properly, I recommend voodoo dolls and druid incantations -- or maybe call in your priest to sprinkle on the holy water.

Charles Mhttp://kuromatsubonsai.com/?page_id=156

Hello Charles. Clicked your link and there's nothing there. Posting tutorial at the top of the page.

I edited my post and fixed the link. I tried it from my forum post and it should work now.

Charles M

Hi

Not easy to admit, but I either had a brain-fail, or a google-fail.

I seem to remember that germination was no biggy.....
Few days ago I decided to go check how long I have to wait before I can expect some sprouts, only this time atlas+cedar+germination results told me I need to pop some seeds in the fridge for a few weeks......

For work reasons at least another week before I can get to that.......bonsai from seed really is the long road....

Hi Gerhard, growing cedar from seed is a great way to get beautiful trees. When a nurseryman raises cedars he will go to a great deal of trouble to ensure a straight trunk, consequently when you go to the nursery most cedars are only suitable for formal trees. When you seed raise them you can put a wire on the trunk when the tree is very young and get beautiful movement into your tree right at the base.
If you have the space cedar are good subjects for field growing if not you can grow them in large containers and feed them heavily which they love.
Good luck with your seedlings
Craig

Hi Craig

For better or worse seed is the only way to go for me.

I planted a few seeds each in 6 pots, my thinking being I'll see what comes up and just thin out.

Since I realized stratification is required I'm think I'll get some more pots and try again, who know what the 1st 6 will do.

Thanks, I'll wire some, leave some straight - all I know is I really want this species in my (small) collection.

Cheers
Gerhard

Charles M wrote:I cannot figure out how to place a photo in this post Charles M

Hi Charles and welcome to the forum.

Posting pictures is easy peasy.



I use the Highlight and Paste method Jim suggests in the tutorial (the link to which is RIGHT HERE ) rather than the Copy and Send one.

Never failed me yet.

Good luck.

Fiona

Hello to moyogijohn.

I seem to remember promising you a pic of my blue cedar about 6 months ago

Here it is. Please note I do not claim this to be a top bonsai or anything even like it. As I said way back in this thread, I use these trees for practising on because they are ten a penny in my local plant nursery. I have a couple thickening up in the ground currently to make bigger trees but this one was an attempt at a shohin. It seems to have survived the winter and is popping out some new buds.

Although in a bonsai pot, it is far from finished and I will let it grow on for a year at least with only minimum trimming and styling.

It was really just to show you that the material you have is by no manner or means unworkable.

Fiona


Should have said - it is approx 8" in height

FIONA,,,,Thank you for your post and picture...that little tree looks really good ,,nice trunk!!! boy it has been a long time since i posted this..there was someone,,i can,t remember who,,that is interested in cedars also ..i hope he will read this..i am still trying...thanks take care john

Watching this thread like a hawk......but my seeds aren't germinating!

Nice tree Fiona

John, the trunk probably isn't that much thicker than the one in your original post. Sometimes going to shohin size is a good option in that its relative proportions can give that impression of an older tree in a much shorter space of time.

You can't see it but the apex is one branch swivelled upwards, and that is the bit with most development needed. I will let a couple of side-shoots grow downwards to form the new side branches and continue to tidy up the top.

It'll never be a show-stopper but it's been fun.


btw the tree cost me about £7.50 (approx $12) to buy from the nursery over the hill from me. The Ian Baillie pot was about 6 times more expensive and I'll put the tree back in a training pot now that I've remembered to take the pic.

Thanks Fiona,,your tree is going to be great..back to a training pot to bulk up limbs i would guess...take care john

moyogijohn wrote:FIONA,,,,Thank you for your post and picture...that little tree looks really good ,,nice trunk!!! boy it has been a long time since i posted this..there was someone,,i can,t remember who,,that is interested in cedars also ..i hope he will read this..i am still trying...thanks take care john

...that would be me you're talking to. [BTW] my cedar shown somewhere above may have suffered from extreme frost bite...it appears that the leader/apex is dying or has died. (I didn't even root prune the bloody tree yet). However the rest of the tree seems ok... ;-) Good to know your'e hanging in on this beautiful species. Eventually we shall succeed, right

/Loke Emil

Loke Emil,,,They are nice looking trees..Fiona must have the right idea on growing them too..i like the way she chopped hers down,,it looks like a bonsai!!! i think that is the way to go...watch the roots when you prune ok?? take care john