The end of the Internet - Facebook and all it's variations

Khaimraj Seepersad wrote:Now what about those dammned Phones and Tablets, geez, everything is a memory or poor English.
Hmmph -

And so Kevin bore the brunt of the angered Elders, down to his electronic socks -

Music to die by , so much for 600 million years of evolution -

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F7jSp2xmmEE

Enjoy.
Khaimraj

Not meaning to be rude or confrontational but if you think all of this is such a lost cause why are you still here?

I have not noticed a good deal of productivity being posted from you. You talk about growing things from seed so you really have an excuse to not have any results to show when questioned but yet, you are ready to tell the rest of the bonsai world how they should roll. And now; you are telling us we should just go ahead and roll off the edge of a cliff.

JimLewis wrote:

i love this abe lincoln quote:

"when i do good, i feel good.
when i do bad, i feel bad.
that is my religion."

But I bet he used proper capitalization.  Get off your damn phone, Kevin!

sheee-it jim... it will be a cold day in hell when you see me typing on a telephone.
i do not own a smart phone... my phone just makes phone calls.
however, i do have a "tablet" but do not use it for typing...

i'm just a lazy, 2 fingered typerist

beer city snake wrote:

sheee-it jim... it will be a cold day in hell when you see me typing on a telephone.
i do not own a smart phone... my phone just makes phone calls.
however, i do have a "tablet" but do not use it for typing...

i'm just a lazy, 2 fingered typerist

And here I thought I was the only person left in the world with a standard "dumb" cell phone! We have many similarities, all would be great if you could just get past the fakebook thing

Vance,

the problem with words, no emotions, I am just teasing Kevin, and I think he knows me well enough to know when I am teasing.
Check out the Youtube video.
No sweat.
Later.
Khaimraj

Vance,

I sent an image of a tree in another topic, where I end up asking, when the design is at it's end, what's next ?
Do I spend the rest of my life just posting old photos of trees at their best, or do I do like I believe Dan Barton, and get rid of them, moving onto other efforts.

Yes, I grow from seed, and cuttings, but they do tend to evolve into what they need to be in about 5 years, as I learn what makes them tick.
So it's not as slow as most think.

I also dip into untested tropicals, to see how they do, but who would I show, unless I use the standard Japanese cookie cutter shapes, these efforts will just look odd, or get zero responses due to extreme unfamiliarity.

Perhaps my point about Facebook, should have been, the IBC is a great club, been with it since 1998 or so, and though I took about 6 years off before 2009, it's still the best forum around, with Ausbonsai, a close second.
An excellent blend of beginners and experienced growers.
I wouldn't want it to die.
Stay Healthy.
Khaimraj

That video is for myself the vastly over indulged, pseudo-scientific version of what the majority refer to as "evolution." Why can folk just understand the happenings of life are far beyond us, accept that, and live with nature instead of taking total advantage of it and trying to "explain" how it happens.I do get a good chuckle though at these "explainers." As much as i would love to see all this technology gone, there is really no reason with the proper consciousness these technologies can't be used symbiotically with the earth as our ancestors did for thousands/millions/billions of years. Now will folk take it there or will there be a continuing "de-evolution" of the youth. As a camp counselor for 6 years i noticed a steady decline of the youth's excitement, understatement, and over all respect for the natural world. It all starts with the education of the youth, stuff that nature back in them little heads!
It does seem there are trends in the bonsai community at times. I don't think i would put this cyberspace local in the same category as social media, although it does provide a social outlet, for the most part i've found bonsai folk to be of a different mindset of the majority of social media users. Yall are cool...

AppalachianOwl,

what we do on our side, is simply take the young ones out to see the world. One of our beaches, has coal, fool's gold, incredibly plastc clay, mud volcanoes and wildlife. Just the drive though the coconut estates to get to the beach, gets oohs and aahs. Let a hawk show up and it's stop the station wagon.

Even a walk through Port of Spain, will get the minds working, lots of conversations, so many mixed folk, clothing, old buildings, trees, birds and so on.
The key thing is to encourage discussion.Even a visit to a store can be a learning experience, with regards to products, where they come from, how are they made, uses, etc.

I used to be a boy scout, and my specialty was to tell stories, all the stuff I read, it was so easy to share. Plus, teaching the younger ones to climb mango or kaimite trees, guava as well, making bows and arrows, slings, the discoveries.

Today, I share as much as I can with my younger cousins, let them see the island, bathe in the springs, visit the uplifted waterfall, mud volcanoes, and get to know our wild life.
Use the clay to make things, driftwood for carving, sea oil wax also for carving, build basic circuitry, turn wood for example chess sets, grow vegetables the organic way, paint, draw, as I was taught. My sister teaches how to weave, knit, sew and so on.
Lots of discussion.
Later.
Khaimraj

hey K !
don't drag me into this !!!
(i may not get the gist of your ribbing as youtube is blocked here at work and it will be several nights before i am in front of a home computer...)

appalachianOwl wrote:there is really no reason with the proper consciousness these technologies can't be used symbiotically with the earth as our ancestors did for thousands/millions/billions of years.

uummm... er... huh ???

Kevin,

it was supposed to be Facebook, and then all the IP pads, tablets, phoes with cameras and whatever else follows. By the way I was gifted with a tablet last year for Christmas, I have yet to use it, but it is loaded with chess games, tetris and mahjong. I have a Largan, which is as far as I go with modern cameras, but I did spend years 15 to 16 in the darkroom with black and white photography.

Oh, and I have a simple synthesizer [ Thomas Doly rules ] so I haven't dumped technology, my houses are Solar powered with Leds, and I upgrade my organic gardening with reading. I was building a solar firing kiln, but I got sidetracked, abit.

So my tease was was supposed to be - ono not more modern toys - and from Kevin the hater of Fakebook - the pain, oh the pain [ Dr.Zachary Smith ] - ono

The video is a very fast version of evolution, very fast, fun music, but to make you smile, especially the ending.

I hope one day to terra form a planet, if that gives an idea of my version of the future [ too much Star Trek - you know the one with William [Shattered Face as mum said I used to call him ] Shatner.
Fly to the stars, beam down and save all of our wildlife from extinction, give them their own planet to continue to evolve.
Later.
Khaimraj

Hey Khaimraj,

I agree that less that 1% of folks will actually make major breakthroughs in their professions. Hopefully, most of the other 99% will make some positive change as well.

I also agree with your statement that we become more thoughful as we age. I know this because I'm at that age. With this in mind, I think back at my childhood and some of the antics we pulled - we didn't always make the best decisions. But those days are fleeting. We learn pretty quickly that in order to get along, we need to get along. The "feel good" or "entitlement society" won't last. They will mature to become the same adults were are, always complaining about the younger generation.

Steve

P.S. Kevin must have cut and pasted the quote from Wikipedia.

Minus the ecosystem difference i did the same Khaimraj, there needs to be way more of this type of education. What was trying to say Kevin, rather confusingly wrote i apologize; our ancestors lived with nature, there is no reason we cant do the same with the technology we have. I agree with ya Steve, it can't last.

wow, I've been on vacation from IBC and I come back to see that this type of discussion still goes on
This has renewed my faith in humanity somehow... this and the fact that our country managed to kick off our previous dictator of a prime minister all thanks to the Internet and to youth who managed to use that tool wisely to propagate REAL information on what was happening on the island.

Our previous PM was hijacking our proper communication channels, mostly TV where the general director was his underling and thereby manipulating information to favor the then current regime. I was pretty tense, people who were seen mingling with the opposition ( now current new government in place ) were licensed the next day. There were isolated but intense fights among partisans in some "fanatical" areas. But all those were kept undersilence by normal media channels ( TV and newspapers ).

There were bribes and intimidations, and those too were held silent by TV and newspapers.
The newspapers were NOT into hiding the info, but placing them on paper would be bad for them in the then current states. Or too late after the events or too late after the news with the backing of police would have reported otherwise.

Instead people used FB and audio and videos to share what was really happening. People actually recorded ministers bribing people, recorded ministers saying things that would never have been shown in the news papers but which were true and factual and showed how much in danger our future would have been if dictatorship had continued. People recorded videos of the bribing and intimidations and gave a true picture of what was REALLY happening.

Its thanks to social media like FaceBook, Twitter, YouTube and Google that we have now a new regime and several organisations are having a restructuration. That we can have a chance to be saving MILLIONS (literally millions ) that would have been injected into unnecessary projects like a charcoal power station, a fast train project and other high cost projets when half the population have not been getting a single drop of water for 2 weeks.

We got REAL NEWS ON DEMAND AND WHILE IT WAS HAPPENING. That was the beauty of facebook or twitter.
YouTube and SoundCloud gave us real multimedia info. Local radios and newspaper started to use YouTube as an alternate TV company. And the government could not hinder that, they could not influence that, they could not errase what was posted. On the local TV what was showed was over after it was showed. Radios and Newspapers started to use SoundCloud to record and allow people to listen and relisten to what political parties said or share those recordings that the population should be aware of but that the then current government would NEVER EVER allow their puppet TV to show or play.

All in all from all the above discussion I've seen and the title used, I realize that some people still don't grasp what the Internet is and confuse it with the World Wide Web.

Facebook and all its variations are TOOLS or one tiny little part of the Internet ( 'I' capital ) that makes use of the World Wide Web (WWW)

The Internet is global system of interconnected computer networks that use the standard Internet protocol suite (TCP/IP) to link several billion devices worldwide. It is an international network of networks that consists of millions of private, public, academic, business, military and government networks.

All your emails, all your phone calls, all your gps etc makes use to some extend of the Internet. All those p2p ( peer to peer ) services, chat applications ( yahoo chat, msm chat, Skype, WhatsApp) , Internet Relay Chat (IRC and yes people still use this ) makes full use of the Internet, be it WWW protocols or other protocols to communicate between them.
The Internet has become a real part of our daily lives. Be it for personal, academical or military purposes.

The "end of the Internet" is something that would mean the end of many civilisations on Earth. Not all, I guess some tribes in amazone would be safe


The way I see it, its not facebook and all its variations the issue. Its people's mindset and their approach to those technologies.

Without this forum I would still be with my first stick in a pot. Its the various forums and websites all over the world that helped me progress in this wonderful art that is Bonsai. Without this forum or other forums I would never have been able to "meet" you guys and learn from you all and share what little bonsai experience I've had.
Without YouTube I would never have "met" Ryan Neil or Walter Pall or Kimura or John Naka.
Without Facebook I would never have found other bonsaika living in Mauritius and talk to them and meet them and share our bonsai passion.


Don't blame the knife for cutting your finger, blame yourself for not being able to use the knife to properly cut the vegies.

Read it up :
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Internet
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/World_Wide_Web

Xavier,

please note, I like and respect you as a person, but this has gone a little too political.

Before I sign off from the topic [ as I believe the moderators will shut this topic down ] let me state that the concept of Democracy, as it was practiced through the ages, with folk talking their way into posts, as in Ministers,--------

IS an outdated and useless practice. I believe we have evolved past talking nonsense and getting into positions by gullible folk who are so easily bamboozeled.

I work towards the idea that such positions should be done as a business situation, which ever ministry you wish to head, you should have a degree in Business and a dgree in the area you wish to be employed in, example Agriculture fore example.
To apply for the position, you must have proven your abilities with success in some very large coporation or other and be over 50, or show extreme positive experience at any age.
You are then hired for a small salary, and understand the honour to serve your country, so the pension will also be small.

I am now disconnecting from the Discussion.
Merry Xmas to All.
Khaimraj

Khaimraj Seepersad wrote:Xavier,

please note, I like and respect you as a person, but this has gone a little too political.

Actually, I think he spoke a lot of sense.

fiona wrote:

Khaimraj Seepersad wrote:Xavier,

please note, I like and respect you as a person, but this has gone a little too political.

  Actually, I think he spoke a lot of sense.  

Yes, he did! It was a great example of a beneficial use of facebook and other social media.

If anything, it was Khaimraj who made it political.

Hello, Xavier!

Xavier de Lapeyre wrote:... ... All your emails, all your phone calls, all your gps etc makes use to some extend of the Internet. All those p2p ( peer to peer ) services, chat applications ( yahoo chat, msm chat, Skype, WhatsApp) , Internet Relay Chat (IRC and yes people still use this ) makes full use of the Internet, be it WWW protocols or other protocols to communicate between them.
What about intimacy?

The "end of the Internet" is something that would mean the end of many civilisations on Earth. Not all, I guess some tribes in amazone would be safe
So, do you really consider www is civilization?
Could you elaborate this quote a little more, please.
The advance of technology is one issue and civilization is a different one, in my ignorant's opinion...

The way I see it, its not facebook and all its variations the issue. Its people's mindset and their approach to those technologies.
Absolutely!

Without this forum I would still be with my first stick in a pot. Its the various forums and websites all over the world that helped me progress in this wonderful art that is Bonsai. Without this forum or other forums I would never have been able to "meet" you guys and learn from you all and share what little bonsai experience I've had.
Without YouTube I would never have "met" Ryan Neil or Walter Pall or Kimura or John Naka.
Me too!

Read it up :
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Internet
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/World_Wide_Web
Please, do not consider Wikipedia as granted. You will do a great favour to yourself   Try to use other sources for justification    

Glad to participate with all you great people!

...and as far as the "political" subject above I dare say we shouldn't be afraid of talking political. Political I say, NOT politics. Different subjects.
In any case,

"man is political animal by nature"

as said our (and the world's) Aristotle!
So, why not?
I take the above mentioned by Xavier just as a paradigm regarding the benifts of international communication through www

Alexanderia,

folk like you, Fiona, and Chris live in fairly stable situations. When Governments go corrupt, absolute power corrupting absolutely, historically intellectuals, and their kin, are the first to disappear.

Information on the Internet goes both ways, folk disappear quietly. So you go - Anonymous - We Are Legion - DO - but shut up on the Internet.

My words were to shut up Xavier, since he is young and inexperienced, I have lived through an attempted coup, and curfews.
I pass on a new way of thinking, as humans evolve even more.

This is not an over-reaction, but I do like Xavier, he isn't just a name for me on a forum.
Hope this explains.
Later.
Khaimraj

Khamraj,

Why is it so difficult to understand that the internet is a blessing and a curse at the same time?
The internet will never dissapear, that is a fact.
Why have the need to complain about it? There is no end to complains about it, try to accept it
If you are an intellectual as you like to be seen, you should be smart enough to understand no?
Running away is an option of your choice, not the fault of internet.

You seem to have a good life so just take the benefit from the internet and dont maken it your curse,
I think you have too much free time if you let idiots on the internet bother you

Grtz
Tommy

Wise people will use the internet or any form of media like FB to his advantage and will prosper with it. and those who cannot adopt, specially those who tried many times but failed will declare these new tools (like Facabook) as a threat to their preferred tools and some will even despised it.
Worst, some will even try to drag others to hate these new tools as well.

regards,
jun

Tommy,

as far as I have read, the Original use of the Internet was the transfer of research from various institutions. As usual with firsts, one can make a great of money being the first in this or that. So now Facebook might been first, but I did get an invite to another Facebook from Asia, just another name. So I would imagine there are quite a few out there.

Once again, I am not an Intellectual, or a Bonsai Master or a Master of anything. I have a curious mind, and I ask and read a great deal.

Please note this has happened in the 19th, 18th, 17th.................................................................0th century, and is
nothing new, just I don't like being forced to join a situation [ in this case re-join ] when there was a search feature before, feels like it is no longer a choice. Save a choice to just not interact, and watch a lot of things die.
Later.
Khaimraj

* Then sadly LLB, I will be not wise and fade away from the Internet save to buy books from Amazon.
Nice to read you again.
Merry Christmas!!!

Khaimraj Seepersad wrote:Alexanderia,

folk like you, Fiona, and Chris live in fairly stable situations. When Governments go corrupt, absolute power corrupting absolutely, historically intellectuals, and their kin, are the first to disappear.

Information on the Internet goes both ways, folk disappear quietly. So you go - Anonymous - We Are Legion - DO - but shut up on the Internet.

My words were to shut up Xavier, since he is young and inexperienced, I have lived through an attempted coup, and curfews.
I pass on a new way of thinking, as humans evolve even more.

This is not an over-reaction, but I do like Xavier, he isn't just a name for me on a forum.
Hope this explains.
Later.
Khaimraj

I fear that the "stability" you refer to is becoming more and more of an illusion. The U.S. government (and most governments, probably) is full of corruption and abuse of power, and things seems to be getting worse. It used to seem like "it couldn't happen here" but I don't feel that way anymore. The growing chasm between the "haves" and the "have nots" seems unsustainable. What does the future hold...

I don't know, but lately I've been thinking about which South Pacific Island to retire to!

Has t'internet apocalypse happened yet?

Bloody better not have - I've got a lot of buisness to do, given that a fair bit of my work is now done online which has opened up lotsa new opportunities which I wouldn't previously have had. Not to mention the many new friends I have made through things like the much maligned Facebook. Not to mention the fact that finding stuff out becomes a whole lot easier. Not to mention that my 89 year old uncle is able to keep in touch with his kids and grandkids at a time when he is almost completely immobile.  Not to mention a whole host of other things which are no doubt totally mundane and beneath those in the fine art world but which are, quite frankly, what keeps the bulk of us human. And happy.

Now if you don't mind I must away as I want to start a proof-reading task for a chap I know who lives a thousand miles away. He has just emailed me his first draft and I hope to get it turned round quickly and back to him - also by email to save time.  Our paths would probably not have crossed had it not been for the internet. It has worked out to both our benefits.

Someone mentioned a few posts ago about shutting this thread down.  

Nah. That would be power corrupting, would it not?

Fiona,

a hint - Internet started to faciliatate Research ------------ who pays for it all today - willingly - eh ?

Ever wonder why all the tiny solar panels for bobble heads, or helicopters or other, toys, but the parts, where from and why toys - whose paying for what ?

Research is how you improve, but how do you pay for it ?

How to raise a carrots - send 25 Cents [ seen in 1925 or so in the classified ads in the US newspapers ] - what you get.
a photo of a hand holding a carrot.
Later
Khaimraj [ Honest Injun ]

IMHO many of us use the internet for purposes which suit us, and those purposes nowadays for the bulk of internet users are social rather than intellectual.   Most of also KNOW how sites like Facebook, eBay and Amazon are  paid for.  Similarly, some research on the internet is free while some is by subscription. It is, however, generally paid for by people who commission that research. The internet does not "generate" research as we know it; it merely disseminates it.

And on that issue, research isn't exactly free of corruption itself. Most of us reading research reports know that the first thing you do is to ascertain who commissioned them as the result is often skewed towards the purpose of the commissioners.

Anyway, I am really bored with this thread now. I accept that some like to see a greater purpose in the internet - if that's what you want from it then that is fine by me.  But it doesn't alter the fact that many of us want something else entirely.

It does not make us lesser beings.