defoliation

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defoliation

Post  jamb on Mon Jun 29, 2015 9:17 pm

How many defoliation you can be done in a year and what are the time and manner


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Re: defoliation

Post  beer city snake on Mon Jun 29, 2015 9:21 pm

wow thats a vague question !!!

depends on the species...

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Re: defoliation

Post  jamb on Mon Jun 29, 2015 9:28 pm

For example carpinus and tilia cordata

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Re: defoliation

Post  JimLewis on Mon Jun 29, 2015 9:40 pm

It also depends (a lot) on where you live. I checked the web and see that Milan has an approximate 5-month growing season (last frost to first frost), so I'd guess one defoliation for those species in the average year. Two, perhaps, in a warm year. So I'd do it now. If you were hoping for two, you might have tried in late May or early June.

Note: This is offered from the other side of the Atlantic ocean based on web data. Also based on my experience with Korean hornbeam, not European species.

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Re: defoliation

Post  jamb on Mon Jun 29, 2015 9:50 pm

I ve already defoliated my tilia three times, one at 15 of may, one at 10 of june and one today.If the plant will develop well i will try ' with carpinus


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Re: defoliation

Post  beer city snake on Tue Jun 30, 2015 12:31 am

wow... 3 times... must be a pretty vigorous grower !

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Re: defoliation

Post  LanceMac10 on Tue Jun 30, 2015 3:35 am

yo, fratello.....foto.......? Cool

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Re: defoliation

Post  JimLewis on Tue Jun 30, 2015 1:16 pm

Yes.  Pics would be nice to see the results of that many defoliations.  Sounds a tad dangerous to me. And if you had already done it, why ask?

Moving to questions

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Re: defoliation

Post  denzel62 on Tue Jun 30, 2015 4:41 pm

Pay attention, normally one defoliation every two years, depends by the status of health of the plant, could be enough. Defoliation is a very expensive event for the plant and repeat it a lot of time in the same season can be destructive.


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Re: defoliation

Post  M. Frary on Wed Jul 01, 2015 2:38 am

denzel62 wrote:Pay attention, normally one defoliation every two years, depends by the status of health of the plant, could be enough. Defoliation is a very expensive event for the plant and repeat it a lot of time in the same season can be destructive.

Thir! Yeth Thir!
I don't have the foggiest idea of what tilia is even. Nor have I ever defoliated a tree. But I know some plants can recover from it better than others. But that it is also only needed on near finished trees for ramification. Doing it on trees in training will set them back in development.
I don't defoliate trees because the trees I have won't need it. Except for hornbeam.Elms,Hawthorns,American hornbeam ,Amur maple are my only decidious trees. Out of those the hornbeam looks like I may want to strip when they get near competion. The rest reduce very easily by trimming back new growth every so often.

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Re: defoliation

Post  jamb on Wed Jul 01, 2015 12:09 pm

tilia


carpinus

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Re: defoliation

Post  jamb on Thu Jul 16, 2015 3:18 pm

after the third defoliaion


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Re: defoliation

Post  Leo Schordje on Sun Jul 19, 2015 5:01 pm

Hornbeams (Carpinus) - are distantly related to beech, (Fagus), beech DO NOT survive being defoliated. I would hesitate to defoliate a hornbeam. Ramification will reduce the size of leaves over time. No real need to defoliate Carpinus.

Tilia (the USA native species is known as Basswood) do survive defoliation nicely, and because their leaves are naturally large, it is needed to get good leaf reduction.

Nice work on the Tilia. If you do defoliate the hornbeam, let us know if it worked, or if it kills the tree.

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Re: defoliation

Post  leatherback on Sun Jul 19, 2015 8:40 pm

Leo Schordje wrote:Hornbeams (Carpinus) - are distantly related to beech, (Fagus), beech DO NOT survive being defoliated. I would hesitate to defoliate a hornbeam. Ramification will reduce the size of leaves over time.

Very much depends on the whereabouts I would say. I defoliate hornbeams once or twice a year. Beech will accept a defoliation if well established (So no defoliation at all in the year of repotting, for any of them) and results in very fine growth (Which is prune to freeze-damage if too late in the season, sigh.. )

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Re: defoliation

Post  Leo Schordje on Mon Jul 20, 2015 7:05 pm

Interesting, yes I guess you can defoliate these species, with the warning you provided. Only vigorous healthy trees will benefit from defoliation. My failures were most likely due to the trees not being vigorous enough and my growing season being shorter than more southern areas.

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Re: defoliation

Post  AlainK on Mon Jul 20, 2015 8:59 pm

Hi Leo,

Leo Schordje wrote:... beech, (Fagus), beech DO NOT survive being defoliated.

This is not true, at least this is not true everywhere.

Where I live, near Orléans, France, we have a milder climate in winter than in Illinois I think. Here, Fagus, that are mountain trees that live in much harsher and wetter climate especially in the winter, are not "native trees". Yet I brought some from the forests in "Massif Central" (low mountains in the center of France, max. height + or - 1500 meters) and in spite of this year's heat wave, I defoliated a tree from a seedling I brought back from holidays some 20 years ago:

15/06/2015:





20/07/2015:



I've just checked the temperatures on my outside thermometre (in the sades): 17.1 <-> 36.9

I already defoliated it, in ... 2011, 2012, 2013.

Last year, in 2014, it was a very cool and wet summer -a rotten summer for holoday-makers, or vacationers, actually. I tried to partly cut the leaves: not only the overall look was ugly and artificial, but there were no new leaves, and no backbudding. A complte waste of time.

Take it for what it's worth...

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Re: defoliation

Post  jamb on Thu Jul 23, 2015 8:12 am

carpinus after second partial defoliation


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Re: defoliation

Post  LanceMac10 on Thu Jul 23, 2015 12:36 pm

AlainK wrote:Hi Leo,

Leo Schordje wrote:... beech, (Fagus), beech DO NOT survive being defoliated.  

This is not true, at least this is not true everywhere.

Where I live, near Orléans, France, we have a milder climate in winter than in Illinois I think. Here, Fagus, that are mountain trees that live in much harsher and wetter climate especially in the winter, are not "native trees". Yet I brought some from the forests in "Massif Central" (low mountains in the center of France, max. height + or - 1500 meters) and in spite of this year's heat wave, I defoliated a tree from a seedling I brought back from holidays some 20 years ago:

15/06/2015:





20/07/2015:



I've just checked the temperatures on my outside thermometre (in the sades): 17.1 <-> 36.9

I already defoliated it, in ... 2011, 2012, 2013.

Last year, in 2014, it was a very cool and wet summer -a rotten summer for holoday-makers, or vacationers, actually. I tried to partly cut the leaves: not only the overall look was ugly and artificial, but there were no new leaves, and no backbudding. A complte waste of time.

Take it for what it's worth...

Very elegant, Alain.....I like the view it gives me and the sensations I feel. Well done.

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Re: defoliation

Post  beer city snake on Thu Jul 23, 2015 12:45 pm

LanceMac10 wrote:I like the sensations I feel.

would you call that a southern equatorial region stirring ? Razz

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Re: defoliation

Post  Leo Schordje on Thu Jul 30, 2015 8:06 pm

Climate, and my growing skills, or lack there of are probably why my hornbeam was only defoliated once in its lifetime. And its life was over.

Climate, and the vigor of the plant involved will determine whether the tree will survive the procedure.

The tree has to be healthy and growing strong.

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Re: defoliation

Post  dick benbow on Fri Jul 31, 2015 7:43 pm

The japanese call this procedure "moto-ba-doe-mae". It is usually done to reduce leaf size an prepare the tree for refinement and show. As indicated in previous posts (thank-you) the health of the tree and the timing of the procedure add to it's effectiveness. It should be a tactic used occassionally and not over done. Only you can determine how well and quickly the tree responds to this tactic, which will give you an indication of it's health and resolve.

My experience has been with satsuki azaleas..and done in early spring. Smile

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