Trachelospermum sp.

I don't know if this is T. asiaticum or T. jasminoides. Of course I would know if it would ever bloom -- asiaticum has yellow flowers, jasminoides white -- but it won't.

I've had this growing over this lava rock in one pot or another for 11 years. It's now in a Robert Wallace pot and looking pretty good (if a bit unruly as befits the species).

Now, all I have to do is get it to bloom. Does anyone have any suggestions???????

JimLewis wrote:I don't know if this is T. asiaticum or T. jasminoides. Of course I would know if it would ever bloom -- asiaticum has yellow flowers, jasminoides white -- but it won't.

Now, all I have to do is get it to bloom. Does anyone have any suggestions?????

Hey Jim, very nice little Tree. I believe what you have is T. asiaticum. T. jasminoidies has a very thick waxy leaf with tell-tale new growth which is long, vine like, and bleeds white when the growth is cut. Good sun and fertilizing often should encourage it to flower for you. I've had both of them and they are quite nice for bonsai if you can wait around long enough to get a decent size trunk. Keep up the good work bud!

ta ta for now,
Randy

Well, this has waxy leaves, white sap and long tendrils (I cut several off before I took the pic) so maybe it's jasminoides. But I thought they both had that habit of growth. I've been waiting quite a while already; I haven't checked to see if there need to be M/F plants near each other.

Hi Jim,

Where did you get this little beauty? From my experience, most of the Trachelospermum that I've seen here in the eastern US (with the exception of FL) has been T. asiaticum and it is a little more reluctant to flower than T. jasminoidies which will flower freely even as a cutting. From your picture, and you know how hard it is to ID from a pic, the leaves don't look glossy or thick enough to be T. jasminoidies to me. If I had to bet, I'd put my money on T. asiaticum. If your die'n to find out, it might be worth putting it into a larger container and let it grow out for a while which should help it to produce flowers for you.

ta ta for now bud!
Randy

It came from a patch that grew in front of my house in Tallahassee, FL (and it never bloomed, either, or rarely -- I vaguely recall the occasional cream colored flower). It was a large cutting originally.

Here are some leaves:


[url=https://servimg.com/view/13427896/346][/url]

The leaves look bigger than the Asiatic variety so I would say it looks more like a T. Jasminoides. The Asiatic variety on the other hand RARELY flowers. I would make sure it gets some sun if it's indoors all the time. I *THINK* flowers grow on last years new growth, maybe you are cutting it too much. I would let it go for awhile and let it grow how ever it wants to and see if it flowers next spring. If that works that cut it back farther than what you normally would and let it grow out some each year.

Good luck!

PS Check out some pictures for the T. Jasminoides and T. Asiaticum: [url= http://gardenoftomorrow.com/jasmine-2/trachelospermum-trachelospermum-asiaticum-confederate-jasmine-5/]Star Jasmine, T. Jasminoides and T. Asiaticum[/url]

Well, it has never been inside a day in its life. It was covered in snow for several weeks this last winter and endured temperatures of 9 and 10 degrees F. and many consecutive days of well-below-freezing temps.

IMHO, plants don't belong living indoors -- tho I do bring trees in for a day or two of display on occasion (not this one yet).

JimLewis wrote:Now, all I have to do is get it to bloom. Does anyone have any suggestions???????

I answered this question the last time you asked it...

https://ibonsaiclub.forumotion.com/t4517-suggestions-on-how-to-get-this-to-bloom

Maybe if you hear it from someone else you'll believe them.

JimLewis wrote:I don't know if this is T. asiaticum or T. jasminoides. Of course I would know if it would ever bloom -- asiaticum has yellow flowers, jasminoides white -- but it won't.

That's not correct either.

Russell Coker wrote: I answered this question the last time you asked it...
https://ibonsaiclub.forumotion.com/t4517-suggestions-on-how-to-get-this-to-bloom
Maybe if you hear it from someone else you'll believe them.

Hmmm - well I hate to say it but actually if you look a bit more closely you'll find a different story. The thread you are currently commenting on is NOT a new thread - another member dug it up yesterday from a year ago (July 2010). The cross-referenced thread where you gave your very helpful and informative answer post-dates this one by 4 months (October 10). Perhaps Jim resurrected the July topic in October because he hadn't at that point got an answer to his original question; perhaps he was just having senior moment. But either way since it was not Jim who brought this issue back into the debate, if it were me I'd be reconsidering that last sentence.


Note to self (and any others who care to read it): always check the dates on posts before commenting.

Ah, good catch Fiona! But I'll stand by the rest, thanks.

Thanks, Fiona. I was a bit startled when this popped up again, too.

Do people seem to be very crabby (Crabbit??) here recently?

The fact remains that, no matter what I do, the %$#@! thing will NOT bloom in a pot, while it bloomed readily, if sparsely, in the ground back in Tallahassee.

Frankly, I just checked the post Russell referred to and while others suggested "bloom buster" ferts, Russel's just seems to compare the blooming potential of the various species. I'm pretty sure now that this is jasminoides (though I'd like to see it and asiaticum in hand and side by side), which should mean it will bloom easily.

Oh well.

JimLewis wrote:Frankly, I just checked the post Russell referred to and while others suggested "bloom buster" ferts, Russel's just seems to compare the blooming potential of the various species. I'm pretty sure now that this is jasminoides (though I'd like to see it and asiaticum in hand and side by side), which should mean it will bloom easily.

And that's the point I'm trying to make. I have friends with yellow AND white T. jasminoides that bloom just fine even on small plants. (It also comes in pink, I have one on a trellis, but it's still rather rare.) I have 2 small T. asiaticum that have different foliage and types of growth. One is small with pointed, flat leaves and fine textured growth. The other has a leaf like yours - wide and wavey, with a more course texture. I picked both of these out of a group of asiaticum at Home Depot. I've seen the same thing in very large blocks of "Asian jasmine" for sale at wholesale nurseries. There they try to weed out the course, woodier one in favor of the other.

Russell and Jim,

I am in the camp that thinks Jim's plant is T. asiaticum just because it is reluctant to flower. T. jasminoidies flowers freely even as a cutting. Another distinction is hardyness and T. asiaticum is hardier (US Zones 7 and 8 ) than T. jasminoidies (US zones 9 and 10) which would have frozen to the ground and died given Jim's description of his last winter. In addition, flower color is another key, T. jasminoidies opens pure white and as the flower ages it turns yellower until it drops off. T. asiaticum opens a yellow color. The only true way to tell is to have both in hand and do an analysis of the flowers. Here is a botanical cheat sheet on the differences between the species.

http://www.efloras.org/florataxon.aspx?flora_id=2&taxon_id=133220

Randy

Randy_Davis wrote:In addition, flower color is another key, T. jasminoidies opens pure white and as the flower ages it turns yellower until it drops off.

Thanks Randy, but again, jasminoides comes in a pure white form, a yellow/gold form and a pink form. The white one does yellow as the flower ages, but it's not the same as the yellow form. All are very fragrant and typically call "Confererate jasmine" in these parts. It's also much hardier than zones 9 and 10. I've lived almost my entire life in zone 8 and I've never seen any cold damage at all.

Dirr says jasminoides can withstand temperatures into the single digits; "leaves were killed at -3 degrees F butstems and buds survived." I didn't get that cold last winter. I did have a lot of very red leaves over the winter and into this spring. They've now yellowed and fallen off.

For reasons I won't go into again here, I've not been able to spend much time with my trees over the last few weeks, so when I wandered out to look at the overgrown mess imagine my surprise to find flowers on my Asiatic Jasmine. These are the first blooms ever, and I've had this little tree in a bonsai pot for more years than I can remember any more.

By the time I discovered them they were a bit past their prime. Oh well.

Congragulations Jim! Lovely little flowers indeed.....very nice composition overall. A "Kodak moment" for sure :-)

Best regards,
Tom

JimLewis wrote: I've not been able to spend much time with my trees over the last few weeks,

I know the scene. I hope you will get to the National. Promises to be spectacular.
Iris

So, Jim, is there a theory of why it finally bloomed? Did you ever try Bloom Booster or the like?

Nope to both questions.

Or, maybe, it was inattention that did it.

Beautiful!!