American elm bonsai

Is this tree similar to other elm trees? Can I apply the same techniques that one would use on a Chinese elm? If not what are the differences because there isn't much information on this tree. One specific question would be leaf reducing techniques and the differences between the other trees. Thanks in advance for any info.

American elm is used for bonsai. Are you old enough to have seen American elm growing? If not, look for pictures. The growth habit is quite different from other elms, and there are those of us who believe it should be respected in bonsai. American elm grows in a majestic vase habit, a form of broom style. Although it is bigger and coarser than other bonsai elms, the leaves will reduce to some extent. Contact Dave Easterbrook, phone 450-686-5059 or David DeGroot, 253-924-5206 for more details.
Iris

American elms are much more like zelkovas than Chinese elms. Actually, they can be hard to tell apart! Anyway, that's how I treat mine.

R

Mnmbjc wrote:Is this tree similar to other elm trees? Can I apply the same techniques that one would use on a Chinese elm? If not what are the differences because there isn't much information on this tree. One specific question would be leaf reducing techniques and the differences between the other trees. Thanks in advance for any info.

American elms make great bonsai, and the species is probably the world champ for leaf size reduction: from 5 inches in nature to 1/4-inch with diligent pinching and pruning. Very underutilized for bonsai, most likely because of the Dutch elm disease stigma.

Zach

I agree regarding leaf reduction. I have a small elm (ca. 10" or so) that I collected as a seedling. I was told by a local university that it was a winged elm (although its twigs had no wings). Under bonsai culture, its leaves stayed fairly small, comparable to a true winged elm I have, but not as small as a Chinese elm. However, when I let a shoot grow out to develop a new apex, the large size of the resulting leaves showed me that it really was not a winged elm, but rather most likely an American elm. These leaves were MUCH larger than the leaves I had on the tree when I kept it pruned.
Oliver

I agree regarding leaf reduction. I have a small elm (ca. 10" or so) that I collected as a seedling. I was told by a local university that it was a winged elm (although its twigs had no wings). Under bonsai culture, its leaves stayed fairly small, comparable to a true winged elm I have, but not as small as a Chinese elm. However, when I let a shoot grow out to develop a new apex, the large size of the resulting leaves showed me that it really was not a winged elm, but rather most likely an American elm. These leaves were MUCH larger than the leaves I had on the tree when I kept it pruned.
Oliver

I bought what was labelled as a water elm at a bonsai nursery this weekend.  Is this the same thing as an American Elm?  

Also, I plan on planting it in the ground for a few years but, when potted, should I use my inorganic aggregate that I use with success for Chinese Elms or something more organic?  I read where they like rich moist soils in their native environment. 

Thanks.

steveb wrote:I bought what was labelled as a water elm at a bonsai nursery this weekend.  Is this the same thing as an American Elm?  

Also, I plan on planting it in the ground for a few years but, when potted, should I use my inorganic aggregate that I use with success for Chinese Elms or something more organic?  I read where they like rich moist soils in their native environment. 

Thanks.

American elm (Ulmus Americana) and water-elm (Planera aquatica) are definitely not the same thing. Water-elm is not picky regarding soil. Just keep them moist, well fed and give plenty of sun. They love summer heat.

If you can post a photo of the leaves, I'll be glad to give you a positive identification.

Zach

Thanks!

Thanks!

Sorry about the pics. The dropped right when I posted and I can't edit. Thanks for you help.

Those don't look like water-elm leaves to me.  Definitely not American elm.  Here's what water-elm leaves look like:


I'm not sure what you have.  The irregular sawtooths reminds me of winged elm, but I don't see any wings on your tree.

Sorry I couldn't give you a positive ID.  Maybe someone else can chime in.

Zach

In addition to lacking wings on the twigs, the sawtooth edges on the leaves are much coarser that what I see on my winged elms (ulmus alata). The leaves almost look like zelkova, don't they? To add to the confusion, I have read that American elms (Ulmus americana) are also sometimes called "water elms". Another reason to avoid use of common names.
Oliver

Oliver Muscio wrote:In addition to lacking wings on the twigs, the sawtooth edges on the leaves are much coarser that what I see on my winged elms (ulmus alata).  The leaves almost look like zelkova, don't they? To add to the confusion, I have read that American elms (Ulmus americana) are also sometimes called "water elms".  Another reason to avoid use of common names.
Oliver

Good point. Maybe you have a zelkova. I don't work with them, so can't confirm.

Zach

Are there some sources for true American Elms that can be developed for bonsai. Expensive?

DougB wrote:Are there some sources for true American Elms that can be developed for bonsai.  Expensive?

I have stock from time to time.  Sold out till next year.

Zach

I also will be collecting some for sale too. Not too awful expensive. Why don't you go out and see if you can find any living wild where you live and collect a couple. These and hawthorns are some of the easiest trees to collect and live.

Thanks for your help.  I will compare it to a Zelkova in my yard if it ever quits raining...

Russell Coker wrote:American elms are much more like zelkovas than Chinese elms.  Actually, they can be hard to tell apart!  Anyway, that's how I treat mine.

R

Are you sure you have an American elm? Because they look nothing like zelkova. They have craggy,fissure bark. Big dark green leaves if left to grow unchecked. And if left to grow unchecked will grow a 4 foot leader in a growing season right after collection and a severe chop up here in zone 4. I'm not trying to be contentious in any way.
American elms are more like elms. I have quite a few of all kinds. Chinese varieties. And Siberian elm. And American of course. And I treat them as such. All are way tougher than zelkova which I've had but they can't take the cold here.
American and Siberian being the toughest. I've heard tell of Siberian elms dropping branches but haven't experienced it yet.
I also get small leaves just from pruning for ramification. No need to defoliate these trees. I'm going to defoliate one next year though just to see what happens.

Thanks for the "go out and look" thought Frary, but I will have to leave that to those who are not disabled. Just like Jim at our age we often are lucky to get up out of our chairs to tend our trees. And of course do not plant seeds -- just not enough time left. Not sarcastic just reminding folks that not all are physically able. And I look forward to being able to purchase true American Elm.

DougB wrote:Thanks for the "go out and look" thought Frary, but I will have to leave that to those who are not disabled.  Just like Jim at our age we often are lucky to get up out of our chairs to tend our trees.  And of course do not plant seeds -- just not enough time left.  Not sarcastic just reminding folks that not all are physically able.  And I look forward to being able to purchase true American Elm.

Sorry didn't know. Truly.

No offense.

DougB wrote:No offense.

Phew!