Which Honeysuckle?

Last year I won a shrub honeysuckle in a clump style at a show raffle. It didn't bloom, but I found it very intriguing with its multiple wavy stems. It died over the winter, not sure why. I suspect the window area was much too cold.
I would like to get another one. Does anyone have any experience with these? Bill Valavanis has a Lonicera morrowii, and there are a few European examples on the internet. There is a nursery that is selling good sized specimens. I have a choice of Tatarian honeysuckle, L. tatarica 'Arnold Red,' or honeyrose honeysuckle, L. korolkowii. Does anyone know which of these might be preferable for bonsai? I promise Jim Lewis faithfully I will not grow them in the ground or let the birds get the berries.
Iris

I finally found an answer, since nobody here seems to be answering. There is no record of either species being used for bonsai, so I am prepared to find that it doesn't work. I finally found a report from North Dakota Extension Service: <<`Honeyrose' (aphid resistant; rose-pink flowers and red fruits. Better plant habit and bloom than 'Arnold Red').>> It's cheaper, too.
Iris

Hi Iris. I'd missed this post which is a shame because I'm currently exploring possibilities of honeysuckle. The one I'm looking at is a variety which grows wild in many parts of Scotland and is quite hardy. I haven't a clue which type it is though and am still investigating names. (source of plants not a problem though)

I was intrigued by your final comment:

bonsaisr wrote: I promise Jim Lewis faithfully I will not grow them in the ground or let the birds get the berries.

Issues herein?

Many honeysuckle species which are not native to this continent have escaped and have become rampant pests. Honeysuckles are among them. In my area, Lonicera japonica, a vine, is the primary problem. It ranks close to kudzu as a choker of native shrubs and small trees. Kudzu seems to prefer larger plants to choke out.

Iris is referring to the fact that I'm an avid weeder-outer of exotic pest plants, though I have been known to put them in bonsai pots on occasion, while promising to never let them go to seed if they happen to flower. Especially Ligustrum sinensis, another major pest in this area and ALL points south of here.

fionnghal wrote:Hi Iris. I'd missed this post which is a shame because I'm currently exploring possibilities of honeysuckle. The one I'm looking at is a variety which grows wild in many parts of Scotland and is quite hardy. I haven't a clue which type it is though and am still investigating names. (source of plants not a problem though)

I think your wild honeysuckle is Lonicera periclymenum, which I can neither grow nor pronounce.
It is sort of a semi-vine, so you might try it as a cascade. I have the variegated form, 'Harlequin,' which sits against my fence and mopes.
One advantage of honeyrose, L. korolkowii, is that it does not have the invasive reputation. It is only naturalized in New Hampshire, while L. tatarica is all over the country in Zone 6 down. L. morrowii, with insipid yellowish flowers, grows wild all around here.
Iris

JimLewis wrote: Iris is referring to the fact that I'm an avid weeder-outer of exotic pest plants

I thought it would be something like that. I now have you down as the Van Helsing of invasive plants. We have started officially calling this type of plant a "thug" over here, and I found myself doing my bit for the cause by trying to reason with someone the other day not to take a bit of Himalayan Balsam home to plant. Funny how a good number of these plants are exceptionally pretty - definitely vampiristic.

I have a couple of honeysuckles i'm trying out . Not sure what they are but i'm seeing if i can make then work. They were only going to be trashed anyway.

Your second one could be L. periclymenum. Take a look at this.
http://tin4e.files.wordpress.com/2006/10/contest_hanna_pall_wild_european_lonicera_lonicera_periclymenum.jpg
Iris

If you click on the link, you just get the picture. It is from a Russian blog.
Iris

We pulled out 40 year old honeysuckle 5 years ago for new landscaping. The bushes were hedges in front of the entire front of my house. Two were replanted and four were popped into planters for possible bonsai. The only one I've really worked on was in a workshop with Suthin three years ago. It incorporates the old dead wood with a literati style tree that stands about 15 inches. I usually have reduced the leaves with leaf pruning by now but we've had such a cold summer that I put it off and now we're finally getting 80's and 90's.

This honeysuckle is Lonicera caerulea edulis or the sweetberry honeysuckle. It has pale yellow flowers and is a symmetrical, compact shrub that leafs out early. Jim, I don't think this is the invasive plant of which you spoke.


Norma

Norma wrote:I don't think this is the invasive plant of which you spoke.
Norma

As Jim mentioned, the most invasive vine honeysuckle is Hall's, or Chinese honeysuckle.
There are two bush honeysuckles that are a problem in the US, Tatarian honeysuckle, L. tatarica, and Morrow's honeysuckle, L. morrowii. It is against the law to sell them in certain states, including NY, although I could get L. tatarica 'Arnold Red' by mail order. Some demon-inspired European nurseryman crossed the two of them back in the Nineteenth Century and got L. xbella, with lavender flowers. It was widely sold here for a while & also became naturalized, especially in the Midwest. Cedar waxwings get orange crests from eating the berries.
I'm looking forward to trying Honeyrose.
Iris

Hi Iris,

Getting back to your original question... "what honey suckle would make the best bonsai" .... I wonder if any young honeysuckle plants would be suitable for bonsai but I do know that the L.caerulea v. edulis which was brought here originally from Siberia through Canada has cold tolerance. I actually leave the ones I have in training pots in my outdoor bonsai area but these are very old and have a lot of deadwood that is prone to decay.
I keep the small potted workshop bonsai in my winter cold frame only to protect the deadwood from the piles of snow.

Let me know what you finally get and would love to see a photo ....

Norma

Lonicera nitida which is widely used as a hedging plant in the UK, can make very good bonsai. The leaves are a bit like box but smaller and more pointed. Its flowers are insignificant and green but it does have attractive small berries.

L. korolkowii, the one I decided on, is from Turkestan. There are numerous pictures on the Web. As a shrub, it looks like a typical hedging plant. The U. of Minnesota says it may be harder to establish than other species, but I am not planting it in the ground in Minnesota. The one I am sending for is shipped bare-root, three feet tall, in October, so it will not be a baby. I may just heel it in until spring.
I tried L. nitida once. I think it died.
There is a beautiful honeysuckle bonsai on an Italian site, but the URL is three miles long.
Iris

Here is my Honeyrose honeysuckle that came last fall. I wasn't sure if it was going to be a clump or single trunk, but it turned out to be both.
I have been advised that the most sensible solution is to ground layer it and style it as a multi-trunk. I am assuming either three or five trunks. Any virtual suggestions of which trunks to eliminate will be appreciated. Also, I am not sure exactly where to put the new soil line. I forgot to include a size indicator, but the pot is 10 inches (25.4 cm) long.
I was wrong about mention in the bonsai literature. Nick Lenz, Bonsai from the Wild, has a whole chapter on yamadori L. tatarica.


Side view
Iris

Kev Bailey wrote:Lonicera nitida which is widely used as a hedging plant in the UK, can make very good bonsai. The leaves are a bit like box but smaller and more pointed. Its flowers are insignificant and green but it does have attractive small berries.

Also very good if you want to keep small (mame or shohin) bonsai, although they are vigorous root-growers, and can need repotting twice a year!

I was asking for suggestions about L. korolkowii, on Page 1. I don't have L. nitida.
Iris

I have a Cape Honeysuckle that I got at Lowes in September. Cant wait till spring so I can work on it. May have 3 seperate trunks in there.[img][/img]

Cape honeysuckle is not even in the same family. It belongs to the Bignoniaceae. Since it is from South Africa, I doubt that it requires anywhere near the same conditions or culture as the shrub honeysuckles. I suggest you start a new thread. Let's at least stick to the Caprifoliaceae here.
Iris

Sorry Iris! I'll go to my room now. Joe

I was a little disappointed that nobody had any comment whatever about my Honeyrose on P. 1.
Is it really that hopeless? My plan is to ground-layer it and repot it in the spring, and prune out the superfluous trunks. Not sure if I can wire the heavier of the remaining ones so they are on friendlier terms.
Iris

Iris---I would take the same approach you mentioned. Ground layer it and do a multiple trunk. Sorry but my virt skills are poor to non-existant!!

I have two Lonicera nitida (Shohin). They are very hardy and tolerates pruning great.
They start their "spring" setting new leaves and new growth as early as February, even when it is freezing.

Here is one of the two. It has small flowers in real spring (around may) - nothing to be proud of :-) - and shows purple fruits in autumn.
It is an evergreen, keeping two-three years old leaves during winter, shredding older leaves in late autumn/early winter.

Regards Morten


Shrubby Honeysuckle - Lonicera nitida
Height: 16cm / 6 inches. Age app. 1930. Pot: John Pitt.

The L. korolkowii died over the winter. Then a buddy gave me a collected Tatarian honeysuckle. I sold it to make room for the Nanking cherry. End of topic.
Iris