Reverse tapered trident maple

Hi All,

Last summer I was given this trident maple. Beggers can't be choosers and all.. As it was free, I was wondering why. Well.. The tree had some reverse taper, I was told. When the leaves dropped, it was clear.. That is no understatement.

I am considering cutting a wedge out of the tree, and trying to bolt it closed. But I am not sure that would work.

I am curious to hear your ideas about the road to salvation with this.. Virtuals more than happily accepted

looks like that swollen knuckle is a result of all those branches converging in the same general area, with the biggest culprit probably being the one that left behind that scar when it was removed... maybe just remove most of those and see if that slows it down and allows the base to catch up. so to speak...

maybe even just carve away all that excess... ?

or just trunk chop it below the knuckle and start over...
an especially attractive option considering the cost of the tree

First, I don't speak from experience. In fact, having planted trident seedlings 5 years ago, last summer was my first season to chop. I too have big ugly scars on my trees. From what I've read, tridents will heal eventually, just not quickly. I believe I read somewhere, maybe it was Walter Pall, sorry if I'm wrong, was not to rush the scar healing process. I think this meant that if it was rushed, by allowing the upper section to grow too long, trunk taper may suffer.

As far as the reverse taper, I agree with Kevin that slowing down the growth of the primary branch there by hard pruning might help. It may allow the second trunk section to thicken not only itself. but also the primary section.

I don't think that I'd do a second trunk chop. It looks like that once the upper section develops, the reverse taper may fade into the line of the primary branch. Also, another chop will still leave a big scar and you none the wiser.

What I might do is to remove the branches you don't intend to keep. This will of course keep additional scarring minimized.

I dont see the reverse taper a issue on this tree, you see trees in nature that look like yours all the time, maybe use the taper less trunk to your advantage, it will suit a broom style. if i had this, i'd make a feature out of that lovely callused over wound, i'd hollow it out and bring it down the length of the trunk, there are some indentations and grain lines down that side of trunk that you could follow....


I see something like this in your tree:



I found this example here http://walter-pall-bonsai.blogspot.co.uk/2011/04/hollow-field-maple-4-repotted.html

Hope i dont get in trouble for posting that, but there are many examples over hollow trees over the internet, hope this helps. dont hate the ugly bits, embrace them

In the last pic, in between the 2 low branches, you can see where the callous and bark meet.

I Would recut (grind) the callous from right at the bark flap and up, leaving the top roll Intact.

There is only a wee bit of reverse taper there that this would cure.

IMO you are way to close to healed to give up!

Excellent Material!

Sorce

He can mail it over to London, if he doesnt want it

i gotta say, i'm really digging bobby's suggestion !

I think a good example to Bobbylane.

Another example is this style, the trunk is conical not always.



I wish you a good job.

Hello Daniel

I think carving is the solution to your Trident; it's well on its way to becoming something special. As you can see by that Elm photo, reverse taper is not always a problem...

Thx All,

I was hoping to have a trident without big holes in the trunk. So hollowing out is at the moment not an option for me yet.

Sorce, would you be able to mark n the image what you mean with grinding the sideroll?

If it does not appear, I will learn German and email it to you!

Sorce

P.s. it didn't appear did it?

Maybe?

Well. I can't figure it out again.!

But the other is just the side view pic of the same thingish!

Trying to keep the green circled branch. And getting rid of the others.

The thick red line is where I'd start, and go up to about where the thin lines stops. Maybe just cut the top side a little to restart it.

Yeah. The reverse taper is so little. And these heal so well..
use a good cut paste!

Oh man! I think I figured it out!

It looks like you are gonna have this bulging tissue issue again higher up in the future.

I'm no expert. ....but on everything I have with opposite leaves, I'm constantly rubbing off buds on one side.
Unless it is beyond what will be kept. Kind of a lot to stay on top of until you are actually cutting it down for the fork and ramification.

Peter Tea's blog (though not updated in a while) has excellent Trident info.

Sorce

I did some trimming, and now the tree is ready to take off for summer.

Tridents heal very well and not too slow I had the same problem with a fig. Had to carve it all over again. Noticed that the faster the tree is growing the thicker the cambium is.
Make sure slope it more on the sides. Prepare a large branch to graft there using Urushibata technique.
looking good!

Hi Neli,

Thx for the response, but I did not understand anything of that..

How is Cambium visible? Or do you mean it heals scars more quickly? That I can vouch for. Already 2-3 mm around the cuts have grown over!

As for sloping it.. I kind of like the position it is in now, which is also with a perfect level nebari

What would you want to graft? It is sprouting all over

Drling, I have noticed that a tree growing in the ground (or vigorously growing tree) forms a very thick cambium layer, as opposed to a tree confined in a small pot. The cambium is much thinner on them when healing wounds. Hope I am clearer now.
I personally think you dont have a very big problem. The top corner drawing was what I meant when I said Quote:
As for sloping it.. I kind of like the position it is in now, which is also with a perfect level nebari
>>>to carve the trunk chop to slop more, and then to graft in that place a new branch since you might remove all the buds.
But look at the main drawing. You can always approach graft a branch lower and use as sacrifice to fatten the trunk some more bellow (blue line)
But I think that if you fatten your leader and grow a nice fat branch there the reverse taper will not be so apparent or even not be noticed at all. (see dark red lines.)

I was looking at this tree earlier and it reminded how much inverse taper there is in nature, in this image i dont think it takes anything away from the trees powerful image...the hollow gives an appearance of age also

If you want that wound to heal quickly, you need to nick the edges of the callous where it meets the dead wood with a sharp chisel or grafting knife. Every time you see the callous stop putting out new tissue do this technique. The callous will heal very fast if you employ this procedure. Very nice material...good luck! :

P.S. USE CUT PASTE!!!

Look at it go!!

How is this one getting on, any updates?

Not really.
I tried an airlayer but it did not take. So not the trunk is covered in moss, waiting for spring. Will put the tree in full sun once the leaves emerge, recut the layer and try again. I am not having too much luck with this tree.

ah you wanted better roots? personally i would have probably lived with the base as it is, i have one of these in the ground currently, the base is good just need the trunk to thicken, down the line will probably sell it..

2016-10-24_05-28-54 by Bobby Lane, on Flickr
2016-10-24_05-17-15 by Bobby Lane, on Flickr
2016-10-24_05-17-32 by Bobby Lane, on Flickr

that was before bud break this year, it grew unrestricted all season and put out long extensions
20161024_170521 by Bobby Lane, on Flickr

This was the cutting i took from the main tree,
it rooted very easily
20161024_171134 by Bobby Lane, on Flickr

it will go in the ground over the next few weeks, a raft/clump style in mind
2016-12-15_04-36-41 by Bobby Lane, on Flickr

youre probably asking why did i chop the top off in the first place

i just decided i wanted a shohin, stocky trident, then decided i'd prefer a stocky, trident stump