Japanese Black Pine

View previous topic View next topic Go down

Japanese Black Pine

Post  Joel on Tue Oct 27, 2009 5:47 pm

I need some help about some soil choices for some black pines. I've heard Kanuma is not a good idea to add to soil. I was wondering what anyone elses ideas were. I thought maybe 20% or less of kanuma would be not so bad. With akadama and pumice. Otherwise I'm looking for an idea to add a little acidity to my soil. I heard fertilizing with Miracid would be okay. And kiryu sand is good cause it doesn't absorb water like kanuma. But its hard to find it in anything more than a quart. I wanna buy more like 3 or 4 gallons at a reasonable cost. If anyone has any ideas let me know. And if anyone has any soil mixes that they prefer for pines let me know.

Thanks,

Joel

Joel
Member


Back to top Go down

Re: Japanese Black Pine

Post  Henrik Stubelius on Tue Oct 27, 2009 10:27 pm

For a pine you need a soil mix that retains its granular structure for a long time, pines are repotted every third year or even less frequently with older specimens. Kanuma breaks down way too easily and in my opinion, so does akadama. Kiriyo is fine, mix it with some pine bark if you like. Ask people in your area what works for them, where I live, it can rain for months, so I need very well draining mixes, sometimes pure catlitter.

Henrik Stubelius
Member


Back to top Go down

Re: Japanese Black Pine

Post  Joel on Wed Oct 28, 2009 3:27 am

I would definetely like to use kiryu but can't find it in a larger quantity(3-4 gallons). If anyone has any helpful links that could help me find some that would be great. Where I live I don't get an overly amount of rain. But I do monitor the amount of water that is in my soil. I haven't noticed any problems with akadama yet. But I will keep in mind your comments. I do appreciate all the replies that people leave. I haven't dealt with pines much but will keep in mind everything that you've mentioned. I'm just trying to get ideas and hopefully come up with the best soil mix for my pines in my area.

Thank again,

Joel

Joel
Member


Back to top Go down

Re: Japanese Black Pine

Post  NJF on Wed Oct 28, 2009 9:58 am

I know I'm probably opening a can of worms here, as bonsaists used to fight like cat and dog in Bonsai Talk regarding this.

I personally had a go with some this year with two of my maples and they seem to have done well in it.

http://www.bonsai4me.com/Basics/Basicscatlitter.htm

If you scroll down it shows you what there is available in the US. Dance

NJF
Member


Back to top Go down

Re: Japanese Black Pine

Post  Kev Bailey on Wed Oct 28, 2009 10:09 am

Agree. I've given up trying to convince people that high fired Moler Clay cat litter is excellent. I've used it for more than ten years and it NEVER breaks down. It's almost a porous ceramic. I'm even reusing stuff after sterilising it. Just a case of the ignorant refusing to accept. However, this is the ONLY type of cat litter that is any good. There are dozens of other types that do indeed turn to useless mush.

This is a link to a very good article from one of Britains top Royal Horticultural Society gardens http://www.srgc.org.uk/wisley/2008/100908/log.html love the financial detail!

_________________
“It is not the strongest of the species that survives, nor the most intelligent. It is the one that is the most adaptable to change.” - Charles Darwin.

Kev Bailey
Admin


Back to top Go down

Re: Japanese Black Pine

Post  Joel on Wed Oct 28, 2009 11:10 am

I guess everyone who has replied is suggesting using all cat litter? I have oil dry that has been working great for some other trees. But noone has really mentioned anything about using "kiryo sand" to drop the acidity loevel a little. I was told pines like it in soil that has a PH of 5.0 - 6.5? Can anyone help me a little more or let me know if I shouldn't even worry about it?

Thanks to all again,

Joel

Joel
Member


Back to top Go down

Re: Japanese Black Pine

Post  Kev Bailey on Wed Oct 28, 2009 11:54 am

Kiryu can be used but is expensive. For my pines I used crushed granite and cat litter with some chipped bark and a small quanity of rotted pine needles. Watering with an ericaceous fertiliser keeps the soil acitdity down.

Oil dry is pretty much the same as cat litter or biosorb.

_________________
“It is not the strongest of the species that survives, nor the most intelligent. It is the one that is the most adaptable to change.” - Charles Darwin.

Kev Bailey
Admin


Back to top Go down

Re: Japanese Black Pine

Post  FrankP999 on Wed Oct 28, 2009 12:36 pm

I use turface and granite. The granite I use us GraniGrit - sold as chicken grit in farm supply stores. If you use chicken grit be careful - some is crushed oyster shells which is NOT what you want. GraniGrit is 100% crushed granite.

Frank

FrankP999
Member


Back to top Go down

Re: Japanese Black Pine

Post  JimLewis on Wed Oct 28, 2009 12:42 pm

I know of no cat litter sold in the USA that is suitable for a growing medium. Use Turface or one of its dozens of clones -- Mule Mix, Terra-Green, Profile or several others -- check an Agway store, or with your nearest Athletic department in a high school or university on what they use for track and field surfaces or baseball diamonds.

Oil Dri, sold at auto supply stores, also can be used -- though I'm told that its quality (breakdown-ability) varies widely).

_________________
Jim Lewis - lewisjk@windstream.net - Western NC - People, when Columbus discovered this country, it was plumb full of nuts and berries. And I'm right here to tell you the berries are just about all gone. Uncle Dave Macon, old-time country musician

JimLewis
Member


Back to top Go down

Re: Japanese Black Pine

Post  Jay Gaydosh on Wed Oct 28, 2009 1:17 pm

For the US, I would recommend going to your local O'Reilley's Auto Parts store. They carry a fired clay absorbant material for cleaning up automotive fluid spills. I've been using it for several years. Make sure you get the bag marked specifically as "suitable as a soil amendment". The other type of absorbant material is a chemical-based material.

As for grit, I started using granite poultry grit from the local farm store instead of sand, however, it is 6 of 7 dollars for a 5 pound bag. I recently found a bulk feed store that sells the same thing in a 50 pound bag for less than the price of the 5 pound bag. They carry several sizes of grit so make sure you ask for the largest size they carry.

Jay

Jay Gaydosh
Member


Back to top Go down

Re: Japanese Black Pine

Post  Mario Stefano on Wed Oct 28, 2009 1:58 pm

This is Maxit or Floreopor or expanded clay. It is very solid, absorbing water and it is good to dismiss. Should add 20% peat. So far I've used pumice, or volcanic Pomica or exp.cley, and that's good. Kiryu, Akadama, etc. I never used, and my trees are healthy and happy in what I have.



LINK:
http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_AetZgqbe2wY/Srdby6p74oI/AAAAAAAABGA/YmLy6gOhlZc/s1600-h/IMG_2207-01.jpg

Mario Stefano
Member


Back to top Go down

J. Black Pine

Post  martyhab10 on Thu Oct 29, 2009 1:27 pm

J. Black Pine does very well in coarse sand mixed with 25% peat moss. In zone 7 it thrives along beaches in almost pure sand. The only caveat is an infestation of pine candle borer. The cure is simple. If you see white spittle on your candles, spray with soapy water. That should smother the critters.

martyhab10
Member


Back to top Go down

Re: Japanese Black Pine

Post  Jay Gaydosh on Thu Oct 29, 2009 1:46 pm

martyhab10 wrote:J. Black Pine does very well in coarse sand mixed with 25% peat moss. In zone 7 it thrives along beaches in almost pure sand. The only caveat is an infestation of pine candle borer. The cure is simple. If you see white spittle on your candles, spray with soapy water. That should smother the critters.

You heartless beast, I'm surprised we aren't protested by PETA! Rolling Eyes

Please pass the soapy water... (Neem works wonders, too!)

Jay

Jay Gaydosh
Member


Back to top Go down

Re: Japanese Black Pine

Post  Sponsored content Today at 12:57 pm


Sponsored content


Back to top Go down

View previous topic View next topic Back to top


 
Permissions in this forum:
You cannot reply to topics in this forum