my first japanese black pine

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my first japanese black pine

Post  mikacarrick on Fri Dec 31, 2010 7:40 am

i just bought my first j.b.p.
i never see this species in local competition. also quite rare to found someone who have j.b.p.
so, here, i will need your help in all things regarding j.b.p.
from shaping it, until it care and maintenance.
i'm living at tropical climate area. malaysia.
so, please help me.



i just repotted it this morning. its original container is on the left side. the container that have two trees in it



i'm having difficulties in selecting its front, as well as shaping it. very2 troublesome to shape it as i dont have any experience with this species before. any idea please.. where to cut, what to be preserve.





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Re: my first japanese black pine

Post  Guest on Fri Dec 31, 2010 9:33 am

I like japanese black pine. but we got the same climate as you have and it should be one of the major consideration in owning this specie. It can live in the tropics alright but the health of the tree and it's growth cycle are quite difficult to handle here and should be taken into account, that's why few people owns this specie in our region. I'm about to suggest to plant the tree in the ground to gain good size/girth of trunk, but then again (IMHO) it won't make it in a week in the ground.
Good luck with your tree.

regards,
jun

Smile

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Re: my first japanese black pine

Post  Hombre on Fri Dec 31, 2010 9:52 am

Hello my friend , i'm also new in this species like you , so i make a research over last six months and the result is a lot of information .
The main conclusion is that, we should see them all in practice only making small and very carefully steps.
Also take a look here, these two articles will help quite like helped me to understand the basics.

http://www.karamotto.org/index.php?page=21
http://knowledgeofbonsai.org/species-specific/the-pine/

Regards Lazaros

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Re: my first japanese black pine

Post  Billy M. Rhodes on Fri Dec 31, 2010 10:09 am

The two articles mentioned above are very good concerning JBP, BUT, they were both written by someone in the northern art of the Northern Hemisphere, so the recommendation of seasonal care must be much different than in the tropics or even semi tropics where I am (well almost).

For us repotting is winter (January) (coolest season), needle plucking is fall (October, November) removing candles is ongoing.

I have two JBP, neither is in a bonsai pot, both might go into such as pot this week.

They need well drained soil and a deeper pot.

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Re: my first japanese black pine

Post  Guest on Fri Dec 31, 2010 10:19 am

Billy M. Rhodes wrote:The two articles mentioned above are very good concerning JBP, BUT, they were both written by someone in the northern art of the Northern Hemisphere, so the recommendation of seasonal care must be much different than in the tropics or even semi tropics where I am (well almost).

For us repotting is winter (January) (coolest season), needle plucking is fall (October, November) removing candles is ongoing.

I have two JBP, neither is in a bonsai pot, both might go into such as pot this week.

They need well drained soil and a deeper pot.

...I was about to write the same thing as Billy wrote. So the best thing is for you to wait until somebody gave you an advice with the same specie from the tropics before you cut anything.
This is what I'm saying about growth pattern /cycle of the specie. they will respond differently even from the same tropical area of different geography.

Just wait, somebody might be kind enough to give you personal advice on your tree.

regards,
jun Smile

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Re: my first japanese black pine

Post  Khaimraj Seepersad on Fri Dec 31, 2010 1:14 pm

Mikka,

for what is worth, I grow Japanese Black Pines from seed and I would suggest just learning to grow the tree for 1 year. See how it goes and learn to keep it alive and healthy.

Perhaps, you might wish to purchase some seed [ Amazon.com ] and have someone in the US or Canada post them to you. They germinate easily and you can practice on the seedlings. They do grow fairly fast and there are also articles in the Bonsai Today, that show you how to fast grow for trunk size [ so Jun you to can have BIG pines quickly ] and training techniques.

You may wish to also keep in contact with gm.it.seacom, as he too will be planting seeds. He is India.

I am in the West Indies [ Caribbean ] but I live on the eastern side of a hill, in a wind channel and grow my pines with full sun. My humidity is only oppressive for about a week in August or September, the winds make a difference.

Ask away and I will help as much as I can, but I am only just moving into the training techniques seriously.
You also have actual tropical pines to practice on as well, so take heart.
Until.
Happy New Year !
Khaimraj

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Re: my first japanese black pine

Post  mikacarrick on Sun Jan 02, 2011 2:38 am

thanks to all of you for your input. well, the link that hombre gives is really helpful. they did give somewhat clear information on how to trim the trees. the pictures do help a lot. i do have friend who successfully trained them for a year. he also always gives me his knowledge that he collected during the 1 years process. but now, i still dont have any idea on how to shape this tree. what to cut, what to be done. fuhh.

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Re: my first japanese black pine

Post  mikacarrick on Sun Jan 02, 2011 2:43 am

khaimraj, i also very interested to grow them from seed. but then, from what i read, it is hard for them to grow. i means, not even half of the seeds grow. and when some of them grow, they will all die after some time. do you experience this before?
well, i you got solution for that, i will give it a try. it is more interesting to shape them when they are young. i reaaalllly look forward to do that.
how long does it take for them to germinate?
then, can you please give the link of that article from bonsai today?

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Re: my first japanese black pine

Post  Khaimraj Seepersad on Sun Jan 02, 2011 5:33 pm

Mika,

all you need to do is [a ] Buy some seed, preferably from a supplier who vacuum seals his product.
[b] You can when you get the seed take 5 [ usually 30 or so in a pack ] and plant them in a sterile soil
see what comes up .
[c] Or store the seed pack in a bottle in the crisper part of your refrigerator. I just leave the bottle on the fridge door. After 3 months, try 5 more.

I like Japanese Black pines so much I buy 2 packs of seed a year, and just use the one from the year before to plant. They normally germinate in sterile soil after 10 days.

When they evolve their first true needles I transfer them to a small pot filled with 70 sifted crushed silica sand and the rest of the mix is compost. Pines are supposed to prefer freely draining acid soils.

Some will die, but you can tell after a while because the needles look odd, but that is like 4 or 5 out of 29 or so from a germination. So it isn't a bother.

There are no links as far as I know on-line to Bonsai Today articles [ stand to be corrected ] so here are the years and pages -

Bonsai Today 12 - page 20 - Growing pines from seed - on page 20, the 5 year and 8 year old trees shown are very impressive.

Bonsai Today 10 page - 25 - Pinching and Pruning

Bonsai Today 20 page - 40 - Bonsai from seed - small to miniature - very impressive.
page 51 Cascade style pines

It is obvious that once you know what to do you can have average to good pine trees in 5 years.

As a bonus in Bonsai Today 45 [ excellent beginning of an article - 50 best Shohin ] page 10 features a Japanese Black pine that has 3cm [ 1 inch ] needles naturally - called Sunsho - the Shohin is in a really small pot, but is 76 cm [30 inches ]tall.

It is with this visual proof of well trained pines that I continue to work from seed.

The Publisher is Stone Lantern [ on-line just Google ] and they have a complete issue of all articles on Black Pines [ or Pine in general ?] over the years in one book. I believe you could order it from Amazon.com.
Best of luck.
Khaimraj


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pines

Post  pondo1950 on Tue Jan 18, 2011 3:21 pm

Kaimraj,
Could you post the name of the book on pines sold thru Stone Lantern?

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Re: my first japanese black pine

Post  Hawaiian77 on Tue Jan 18, 2011 3:45 pm

Howzit Mika,

You might want to check out this website;

http://bonsaisouth.com.au/cms3/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=71&Itemid=86

A Hui Hou,
-Tim Cool

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Re: my first japanese black pine

Post  Bob Pressler on Tue Jan 18, 2011 4:31 pm

As was suggested by Khaimraj you may want to just spend some time getting to know that tree. Let it grow and spend the next six months or so observing your tree and studying everything you can about pines. After that I'd bet you have more definite ideas of where to go with your tree.
The Stone Lantern Book is called Pines Growing & Styling Pine Bonsai Bonsai Today/Stone Lantern
It may not be available through them though I was just on their website and didn't see but I'm sure you can find it online.
Hope to see a new picture a year or so from now.

Bob Pressler
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Re: my first japanese black pine

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