Taxodium distichum 1994

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Re: Taxodium distichum 1994

Post  Khaimraj Seepersad on Fri Sep 27, 2013 12:29 pm

Andre',

you are the typical Art student, comes with the ability - chuckle - teasing
Try to not let it become a mental block.
Like I said, I like it, good growing, and I would also encourage you to take a few cuttings and try your hand again.thumbs up 
See Guy Guidry.
Best to you.
Khaimraj

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Re: Taxodium distichum 1994

Post  Andre Beaurain on Fri Sep 27, 2013 1:19 pm

Of course not. And I'm not the Normal Art Student...I'm the difficult one.

Anyway Normal is just a setting on a dryer..... hihihihihihi

No, I understand, I also do the Natural thing, and love it when a tree follows the guidelines of the species. My Celtis looks like a Celtis....my Acacias all look like Acacias, my conifers look the traditional way...But its my older Bonsai that still fits the ' left branch right branch' recipe. And although I will change some like my Eugenia..others will stay like this, like this tree. Because I LOVE it. O yes and my Pine tree is a complete Broom...but this I'm also not going to change. Sleep 

abcd just said to me the most interesting thing..... He said if you leave the tree in water it will eventually form Knees. Out of the water this opportunity will never arise...I never thought of that. Thank you abcd for that insight.

So now I have to find a massive water dish...... O lordy....

Love and light

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Re: Taxodium distichum 1994

Post  Khaimraj Seepersad on Fri Sep 27, 2013 1:54 pm

Andre',

I doubt either Titian or Giorgione were "normal" Art students - chuckle.

Remember the old 1,2,3 [ also seen as 2,3,1 or 3,1,2 if you can get it to work/harmony/dis-harmony ] is for teaching the person about ==== Volume.
It is an important stage to go through. We all save some of our student / early work - memory - joy - achievement , what we carry into the golden years and it promotes contentment/well being. That sense of having done.

You may wish to remember that in nature, the cypress grows where water moves, slowly, but moves - read changing gases - O2 - Co2 [ and nutrients ] etc.
A basin of water would have to dry out daily to be renewed to get the thousands of years of evolution.
So some thought has to go into duplicating the water effect.
Later.
Khaimraj

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Re: Taxodium distichum 1994

Post  GerhardGerber on Fri Sep 27, 2013 2:12 pm

Conversations like this make me worried about my bonsai future....coming from someone that tried to do art with a ruler..... clown 

A basin of water would have to dry out daily to be renewed to get the thousands of years of evolution.
So some thought has to go into duplicating the water effect.
Immediately made me think about aquaphonics!

Andre - I heard they had something on the subject on Carte Blanche last Sunday, did you maybe catch it?

Google it, considering the veggies this technique produces a tree should love it! Then you can still eat the fish.......or just use Koi! Cool 

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Re: Taxodium distichum 1994

Post  Khaimraj Seepersad on Fri Sep 27, 2013 2:40 pm

Gerhard,

if you are being serious, use the Jun created technique.

Take a soft [ 6b ] pencil and simply lightly press a piece of tracing paper over the image of a tree or other on your computer's screen and trace the outline, maybe 6 main to the idea branches and the mass of the tree as leaves go.

This will allow you to study, commit to memory, then relax and imagine.
Later.
Khaimraj

* Remember fish need a bubbler to oxygenate the water, and normally a scavenger to get rid of the fish waste, which then goes back to the tree's feeder roots.

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Re: Taxodium distichum 1994

Post  Leo Schordje on Sat Sep 28, 2013 5:00 pm

A number of websites and books have said that cultivated bald cypress will never form knees. I have seen at least 2 plantings, in the ground, of bald cypress where trees older than 25 years, but under 50 years have developed knees. Both sites were wet site, flooded at least a month or two a year. I have never seen knees develop for upland plantings, but who knows, the trees may or not read the internet, if someone out there has seen knees form at a upland, relatively dry sites, it would be good to hear about it.

Whether or not knees will form naturally in a bonsai pot is hard to predict, the few people who have posted about knees forming did grow the trees submerged in water at least for several months a year.

for years I had a bald cypress trained as an informal upright. A new puppy of mine, chose it as a chew toy, fortunately the dog out grew the tree chewing phase, and lived a long life. (the pup had his one chance, I would have had to find another home for it if it did not learn) Part of the trick to keep dogs from chewing trees, invest heavily in rawhide chew toys, make sure that out in the yard there are bones and chew toys the dog can chew on. Second, bitter apple products. I spray the edges of benches, plastic pots and other areas and items I don't want the pup to chew. The combo of having rawhide and bones around that he can chew and the bitter apple repellent seem to do the trick fairly painlessly. Usually no more than one or two accidents. Most dogs out grow the "chewing everything in sight" phase. Since I tend to keep dogs in the 90 to 140 pound range, there are no benches tall enough to keep the trees out of reach.

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Re: Taxodium distichum 1994

Post  Andre Beaurain on Sat Oct 18, 2014 7:57 am

Update:

Im the first one to Admitt that Nothing is set in stone.....and How wrong can we be....

Tree in its final chaping...I said... Ja right!   "trees final front..." I said.... emmmmmm  

So firstly I did what Yvonne said I must do, I cut the branches back...  They did grow out , but then the thickness didnt really work.  

So I followed Jim s advice and chopped them all off!  affraid

During the winter this tree didnt loose any foliage, in fact they are still on the branches and you see them they slightly reddish brown.  The new foliage filled out quickly this season but the top... o lord  so far it only sprouted on the right.  Suspect

But I KNOW  cyclops  they will sprout on the left as well.

IN the mean time, did I do the right thing.  No the tree can go in a much smaller pot, dont you agree?







Love Light and Awakening

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Re: Taxodium distichum 1994

Post  JimLewis on Sat Oct 18, 2014 1:47 pm

So I followed Jim s advice and chopped them all off!

Hmmmm. I believe my advice was in reference to that fat upper branch only -- but you're right, it'll probably work out eventually. But I'd prune the new growth severely to encourage budding elsewhere -- and feed it a lot of Nitrogen.

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Jim Lewis - lewisjk@windstream.net - Western NC - People, when Columbus discovered this country, it was plumb full of nuts and berries. And I'm right here to tell you the berries are just about all gone. Uncle Dave Macon, old-time country musician

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Re: Taxodium distichum 1994

Post  Andre Beaurain on Sun Oct 19, 2014 8:02 am

affraid

O Lordy.... so I did the wrong thing? hi

Well actually I like it. The thick and straight branches has always bothered me. Im glad I did what I did.

Jim are yo sure I must trim the top branches now already. I thought I must let them first grow first, like a sacrificial branch to gain thickness again. If I trim those top branches now, they wont gain thickness then for the next couple of years... No?

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Re: Taxodium distichum 1994

Post  JimLewis on Sun Oct 19, 2014 2:20 pm

Don't cut them flush. Cut about 1/3 to 1/2. New branches on the cut stubs will help give a zig-zag look, instead of the curved look that wiring gives. But you don't want that much new growth up top right now. You want to push more lower branches and on all sides. Regularly turn the tree, too, so all sides get direct sun every so often. Feed heavily.

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Jim Lewis - lewisjk@windstream.net - Western NC - People, when Columbus discovered this country, it was plumb full of nuts and berries. And I'm right here to tell you the berries are just about all gone. Uncle Dave Macon, old-time country musician

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Re: Taxodium distichum 1994

Post  Andre Beaurain on Tue Oct 21, 2014 8:57 am

I understand, all done and dusted.. Thanks Jim.

I made a bad virtual...is this what I must aim for?


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Re: Taxodium distichum 1994

Post  Leo Schordje on Tue Oct 21, 2014 4:48 pm

I like the trunk on this one. I would definitely try to plan it so the front of the tree allows at least a tangential peak at the hollow at the base of the trunk. I would like the hollow even face on for the front of the tree. Note, I never told you to shorten branches, or to get rid of so many. In my experience bald cypress will fight you if you try to keep branches too  short, and too few. By now I'm sure you know what I mean. My experience with bald cypress is a bit limited, but I've got a couple in progress, started over again in 2012 after loosing an older one. for the last 25 years I have always had at least one seedling, stick in pot, or pre-bonsai in progress. Usually sometime before the tree hits a decade I do something that kills the tree, and I start over again. I have a good feel for what bald cypress don't like.

Bald cypress do seem to be the type of conifer that each branch feeds a specific root or group of roots, and the reverse. Remove too many branches and you may loose an entire live vein. You can end up with a tree that is permanently one sided. If this spring or summer you get any branches sprouting along the long bare section of the trunk, if it were mine, I would encourage it to grow, or you risk that long bare section becoming a dead vein, which would limit your ability to change the front on the tree in the future. I would love to see you be able to change the front to allow a tangential view of the hollow at the base. Tangential view might be better the full face on, but it is one of the better attributes of your tree.

Bald cypress do lend themselves to formal upright, I would continue with that goal. But I think the tree will loose health and vigor if you try to keep the foliage too sparse, in the manner of mountain spruce trees. That is too extreme a style for the physiology of bald cypress. Or if you can pull it off, your horticulture has to be perfect. Where a style that allows the tree more foliage, if you have a bad horticulture day, the tree will have better ability to survive the occasional abuse. There will be some who say I'm wrong, and that is okay, but if they do tell you a bald cypress does well with just a few tiny tufts of foliage, ask them to show you their example. If they do, their horticulture is perfect, find out what they do, because I'd like to know too. I have killed many a bald cypress, I don't think they like tiny tufts of foliage. A more foliated tree seems easy to grow and forgives the occasional lapse in care.

As a model, look more toward mountain hemlocks rather spruce. Or old upright pines from the USA Pacific Northwest rain forest rather than the sparse krumholtz pine. Bald cypress is an excellent stand in for coast redwood styles. There are lots of possible styles, based on the formal upright, that bald cypress can do, but too few branches and too little foliage has always been a problem for me. My horticulture is average, not perfect. I also grow near the cold limit for the species. They survive my winters outdoors without added heat, but that may be part of why I need more foliage on my trees, they may need it to get through my winters.

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Re: Taxodium distichum 1994

Post  coh on Tue Oct 21, 2014 5:14 pm

Interesting thread! I'm looking forward to seeing this tree develop.

I don't have any cultural advice to offer. I've got one bald cypress in the ground developing a trunk. Probably going to dig and work on the roots in the spring, at that time I'll decide whether it needs to go back in the ground (probably) or is ready to be potted and developed. Leo, are you saying that you keep your potted bald cypress trees outside all winter? That sounds risky unless I'm not interpreting it correctly. They seem perfectly ground hardy here, last winter was our worst in decades and the tree looked healthier than ever this summer. But in a pot...don't think I'd want to chance it.

Chris

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Re: Taxodium distichum 1994

Post  Leo Schordje on Tue Oct 21, 2014 5:52 pm

Yep, under the bench, mulched with leaves, bench gets covered with a tarp. As I said before, right now I have had no bald cypress survive my horticulture for more than 10 years. I believe winter of 1988-89 when we had real temperatures (not wind chill) of -25 F, is when I lost one batch of bald cypress. You are right, we are at the northern limit of hardiness for this species. Winter of 2013-14 I did happen to put the bald cypress seedlings I have into the unheated well house, which is below grade and usually stays significantly warmer than outside. But the problem with the well house is trees want to come out of dormancy too early. So as much as possible I try to work with species that will survive the under the bench, under a tarp treatment.

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Re: Taxodium distichum 1994

Post  JimLewis on Tue Oct 21, 2014 6:06 pm

is this what I must aim for?

Well, you could.  That would result in something like this (all of the 3 following images from Google Images):



But bald cypress seldom grow like that. This is the typical bonsai shape we look for -- the flat-top style developed by the late Vaughn Banting:



This is a bald cypress growing wild some where in the southern part of the United States.  The flat top shape was derived from something like this:


_________________
Jim Lewis - lewisjk@windstream.net - Western NC - People, when Columbus discovered this country, it was plumb full of nuts and berries. And I'm right here to tell you the berries are just about all gone. Uncle Dave Macon, old-time country musician

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Re: Taxodium distichum 1994

Post  Andre Beaurain on Tue Nov 04, 2014 7:49 am

Thanks Leo for that... I will keep going strong....and try and bring to hollow back to the front again as it was a couple of years ago.

mmmmmm Kevin so between you and me, I am the expert as far as Taxodium goes. One point for me. Like a Star @ heaven

Jim wow thanks. I love the Natural style and the Flat-top with the Bald Cypress, it looks right. But I will probably go for the first pic...the trusted Formal Upright.

Anyway lets see what sprouts.....

Even as the tree looks now.......a Client visiting the nursery over the weekend and coming to view the Bonsai garden, wanted to buy THIS tree "no matter the cost" he said...
I took that as a compliment...... and of course my answer was a lemon No

Love Light and Awakening

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Re: Taxodium distichum 1994

Post  Leo Schordje on Tue Nov 04, 2014 3:17 pm

Andre Beaurain wrote:Thanks Leo for that...  I will keep going strong....and try and bring to hollow back to the front again as it was a couple of years ago.

mmmmmm   Kevin  so between you and me, I am the expert as far as Taxodium goes.  One point for me. Like a Star @ heaven

Jim wow thanks.  I love the Natural style and the Flat-top with the Bald Cypress, it looks right.  But I will probably go for the first pic...the trusted Formal Upright.

Anyway lets see what sprouts.....  

Even as the tree looks now.......a Client  visiting the nursery  over the weekend and coming to view the Bonsai garden,   wanted to buy THIS tree "no matter the cost" he said...
     I took that as a compliment......  and of course my answer was a lemon No

Love Light and Awakening

You could have given the customer a ridiculously high price, one that would make you feel really, really good about selling the tree. If he bought it, you could take a vacation here and see these creatures in the wild.

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Re: Taxodium distichum 1994

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