A few softly applied thoughts to "Crataegus 2010 "

Hello to All,

rather than hijack Karl's topic, I am placing my thoughts here.

杰遨-jie, nothing wrong with learning a standard, it gives good grounding to evolve. I use traditional rules / guidelines [ if you are into politically correct wording] to work with the typical shapes of tree.
Stay Well,
Khaimraj
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Jun typed - "I think the designer of the trees should be the one to be satisfied first...and other peoples (viewers of the art) opinion is just secondary to the artist freedom of expression."

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Hmm, Jun, if Bonsai is a hobby and you can handle the often negative comments, no problems.

However, there is a genetic bit to look at, trees evolve to grow into a given pattern. They are not plastercine, and will fight you for the rest of their natural lives to return to that pattern.
As an example, on this side I have twice seen two large of trunk, softwooded trees fade away because the owners wanted to do what they wanted to do. Even with the use of epoxy hardeners [ they forgot that moisture also comes from below as well as above and on the sides.]

It was very sad to watch them die over a period of 3 years.

This is why I suggested, Painting, for you. You can do as you wish and not have to deal with genetics.

A tree in the wild, found contorted or wildly shaped, is so due to the elements, unless you provide all of those elements, it will soon revert to it's typical shape, and attempt to heal itself as best as it can.

Aside, I do wonder if all Bonsai is to the many, is a contorted tree with a green hat/s.

I am away and will try to respond as often as I can, if any responses are needed.
Thanks for the patience extended in advance.
Khaimraj

I agree LOL, haha i didnt mean to sound like something is wrong with learning standard..did it seem that way? I just wanted to say that we all see things diff in a tree...and can bend the traditional rules..haha btw, i dont think you would have hijacked karls topic LOL its so much fun to see so many peoples thoughts(i love it)!

杰遨-jie,

not all, I was just agreeing and adding in a summary. In Fine Art, you often find those who abandon the guidelines, before appreciating and understanding them. This then leads to a crippled development as innovation goes. Often innovation goes out the window to be replaced with novelty.
Until.
Khaimraj

Khaimraj,

you should have posted this in continuity with Karl's post. this is not a Hijack.

I totally disagree with you on this one.
first was your suggestion on me regarding painting...I am painting (trying to) since I was 7 year old. that's why I ended up with my present career.

secondly,
bonsai is both an art and a hobby.
base on my understanding of art-art got no limitation... when vincent vangogh created his art during his era of the so "called
traditional art" fellow artists of his called him insane (though he was, Hehe), but the artist of the present time calls him a genius, a misunderstood genius way ahead of his time. base on this premise that bonsai is an art, and considering that bonsai really is an art, do you think you should put a limit on peoples creativity?
even with your so called traditional/ natural way of designing the tree it will always revert to its natural form with in few years of neglect and it wont be a bonsai anymore, so it's the same thing with other non traditional design...live both designs alone with nature and both designs will lost the bonsai in them. with the so called natural design, they look natural but they really are not natural, no trees in nature got the perfect arrangement of branches branches we see in bonsai so they are not natural at all no matter how hard you tried.
Thirdly- who says bonsai should look like what you have in mind. the traditionalist? and people who don't agree with that nonsense has no right to do what makes them happy...I beg to disagree my friend. you do what you think is right and let others do what they think is right. my personal objective in doing bonsai is to make me happy with my work and I don't give a damn on others view on my work...If they like my work it will double my happiness...if they don't that's perfectly fine by me. ITS A FREE WORLD my friend.

innovation is what makes civilization evolved and progress.

no hard feelings my friend its just me expressing my opinion

btw, I designed both traditional trees and the way,way away from the traditional trees...you should also try the other designs too so that you'll know what the thoughts of others might be.

regards,
jun