yamadori karob tree

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yamadori karob tree

Post  theBalance on Mon Aug 09, 2010 3:49 pm

this tree was collected 2 years ago.
I haven't yet decided on an initial design..just let the tree regain is power.
your'e most welcome to feedback

the tree

theBalance
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Re: yamadori karob tree

Post  JimLewis on Mon Aug 09, 2010 4:23 pm

We spell it with a "C" in the USA. I've never seen Ceratonia siliqua used as a bonsai. Please keep us posted on your progress. Informal upright seems the natural "style" for this one.

_________________
Jim Lewis - lewisjk@windstream.net - Western NC - People, when Columbus discovered this country, it was plumb full of nuts and berries. And I'm right here to tell you the berries are just about all gone. Uncle Dave Macon, old-time country musician

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Re: yamadori karob tree

Post  theBalance on Tue Aug 10, 2010 8:59 am

Hi Jim,

Nice to meet you.
10x for the correction...
in Israel the carob tree is very common...not so common as a bonsai..but there are several guys growing them.
it's a tree with a very long life expectancy ( 600+ ) has a very interesting trunk so I decided to go ahead and try.
this item has survived in a tiny place with dirt for many years...and it's a wonder because in israel we have 9 months that are hot without rain...and it was on a southern place...

here is a close up on the nebari :
http://www.tapuz.co.il/Communa/main/ShowImage.asp?path=43584173.jpg&msgid=43584173

regarding the design : I've been thinking a bout the following options
please see this image as a reference to understand A,B,C,D :
http://www.tapuz.co.il/Communa/main/ShowImage.asp?path=43590800.jpg&msgid=43590800

from the trunk exit 4 main branches, and I see the following design options :

1. the smallest possible tree - remain only with A - REMOVE ALL THE REST ( of course in stages so the tree will survive )

2. tree with A+B and remove the rest

3. C as the main trunk creates 3 options : c1 = Informal upright , c2 = slant to the left ( using the left sub branch of C ), c3 = wind swept to the right

4. there is a nother thick branch that is hidden from this angle, and exit the trunk from the same point as C - an interesting option will be to create : A + D

5. live all the branches in a very natural style

your feedbacks are most welcome

alon

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Re: yamadori karob tree

Post  my nellie on Tue Aug 10, 2010 9:30 am

Here is my contribution to this thread as a Greek:
Ceratonia comes from the greek word "keration" which means small "keras", while "keras" means "horn" and obviously it is referred to the fruits of this tree.

Now, I would like to pose my question:
Taking into consideration the kind of leaves of ceratonia which are kind of composite, is this tree suitable for bonsai?
I mean can there be reached a small size of the leaves?
Some months ago while visiting a nursery I had found interesting ceratonias with relatively big trunks, but I did not made up my mind for buying one of them....

Thank you!

my nellie
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carob leaf

Post  theBalance on Tue Aug 10, 2010 2:31 pm

making a bonsai from a tree that have compound leaves is always a challenge…
but this proportion issue can be balanced by making a big bonsai, by ordering the leaf in pads, and so on...
also remember that in this price you get many advantages
 Long life
 Very interesting trunk
 And so many others…

there are many examples of carob bonsai in the internet - you can judge by yourself :

http://saturn2.bonsaime.com/photo/o/1/13/1369.jpg

http://saturn1.bonsaime.com/photo/o/1/13/1356.jpg

can I kindly ask your help in feedbacking on my carob design Rolling Eyes

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Re: yamadori karob tree

Post  my nellie on Tue Aug 10, 2010 2:43 pm

Thank you very much for your interest and your time to upload all those beautiful photos! sunny

theBalance wrote: ... ....
can I kindly ask your help in feedbacking on my carob design Rolling Eyes
I'm afraid I have nothing of importance to comment because I am a novice and I'm still experimenting... and most of all study study study study
Hope that the experienced members will soon leave their feedback for your tree which has obviously good potential.
Perhaps, root over rock style??? Embarassed

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Re: yamadori karob tree

Post  Todd Ellis on Wed Aug 11, 2010 2:27 am

I like the texture of the leaves. Nice looking material!
Todd

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Re: yamadori karob tree

Post  stavros on Wed Aug 11, 2010 9:53 pm

Hi there,

Most probably i would consider shortening the tree, on my quest to make it look more compact-powerful.
I would look at Carob trees in nature and then decide how to style it. These trees have rather sparse foliage, deadwood, rough bark, and an umbrella shaped crown.
My suggestion: Pencil and paper and many drawings with all the possible solutions..........

SHalom mi Kafrisin (hello from CYprus) Very Happy

Stavros

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Re: yamadori karob tree

Post  Guest on Fri Aug 13, 2010 1:28 am

Stavros,

nice tree. its seems to be planted initially sideways. if you got more more primary roots under that soil, try to placed it over in a taller pot, if it looks good i would suggest a semi cascade style for your tree. just remove the first branch crisscrossing the main trunk. you already got an apex on the side (from your angle of photo at least). pull more branch downward if youl go with semi cascade.
good luck.

jun Very Happy

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Re: yamadori karob tree

Post  Guest on Fri Aug 13, 2010 2:47 am



for full cascade. this is from your actual trunk and branch, i just traced the outline of your major branch and trunk...



for semi cascade. some major "slaughtering" is needed.

just in case youl proceed with this style, dont remove the major roots on the right side until your tree becomes stable in its new pot. be sure to cover it with soil then moss, with my trees i put rugs or cloth over the soil and exposed roots, sometimes for years, to avoid dehydration on some branches. then remove the major roots one at a time for some period of time to avoid shock to the plant.

goodluck.

jun

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Re: yamadori karob tree

Post  stavros on Fri Aug 13, 2010 7:00 am

Hi Jun,

This is not my tree (even though i wish it was).

I have never seen Carob trees in cascade or semi cascade style in nature (and there are a lot of those in our area!), so i do not know if the tree's natural habit would lent itself to such a style.

Nice drawings by the way.

Stavros
Very Happy

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Re: yamadori karob tree

Post  Guest on Fri Aug 13, 2010 1:29 pm

Stavros and who ever owns this tree.

Shocked Shocked

IMHO. lot of trees placed in cascade or semi cascade style do not appear in that style in nature.. i even saw acacia and some pines in this style and they look stunning...something unique i think is the most difficult and the most challenging, yet the the most beautiful thing to accomplish. nature anyway is there just to guide us on our design...but its the bonsai designer who will act as "nature" in a sense to accomplish something truly wonderful.

thanks

your friend,
jun Very Happy

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Re: yamadori karob tree

Post  stavros on Fri Aug 13, 2010 1:40 pm

Hi jun,

I respect your opinion of course, but personally i would go for a design following the nature's way Laughing

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Re: yamadori karob tree

Post  Guest on Fri Aug 13, 2010 1:54 pm

Stavros,
same thing here my friend, i respect your point of view very much.
this is why i love this forum...so many ideas coming from different angle from different culture and environment...thanks again my friend....still, i love it to be semi cascade... Twisted Evil Twisted Evil Wink

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10x so much

Post  theBalance on Mon Aug 16, 2010 10:31 pm

Hi Guys,

this carob is my first post in this forum.

I want to thank you all for your intrest and your efforts, it is such a great feeling to discuss things you like with people around the world.

Todd - the texture of the leaves was the first think I liked in carobs, even before I knew what specie it is Very Happy

Stavros - 10x so much for your advise, trees are my masters I always look and learn from them - better then any man...regarding shortening the tree I have a problem, since the leaves are compound and not small...and the carob has leaves all year long - I f I would shorten the tree then the proportion between the leaves and the trunk will not be good...so I guess I will need a lot of patient with this one...

Jun - I took your advise and removed the first branch crisscrossing the main trunk. and I thank you so much for your wonderful drawings...but at this point I feel that making this tree into cascade will be too much un-natural ( in my personal eyes ), but still didn't decide - your proposal is very unique and I may consider this again in the future

some pictures :

the natural movment of the main trunk

the removal of the first branch crisscrossing the main trunk ( B in my pic )

you can see here my plans for stage 2 : removal of the branch (X ) + give movment to the upper trunk

the carob fruit close up ( female carob Laughing )

theBalance
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Re: yamadori karob tree

Post  Pola on Tue Aug 17, 2010 5:41 am

Interesting trunk.... i agree,that first branch crossing the front had to go. I see a semi-cascade or maybe a very slanted form,growing on a small hill....crazy imagination!! Very Happy

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Re: yamadori karob tree

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