Wound sealant, cut paste etc. Experiences, advice and what (not) to do?

Page 3 of 3 Previous  1, 2, 3

View previous topic View next topic Go down

Re: Wound sealant, cut paste etc. Experiences, advice and what (not) to do?

Post  AlainK on Fri Apr 27, 2012 8:07 pm

[quote="drgonzo"]
Sakaki wrote:
It's just an example of my personal experience

Thanks for sàoiringh Laughing

AlainK
Member


Back to top Go down

Re: Wound sealant, cut paste etc. Experiences, advice and what (not) to do?

Post  Sakaki on Sat Apr 28, 2012 12:05 am

Dear Jay

I and you are talking about different things.
I pointed out these differences to say that if you aim to prove efficiency or inefficiency of something scientifically, then you should make the test on samples (i.e. cuts) that are identical with regard to their size, location, depth, thickness, etc.
I do not mean that your treatment does not serve the purpose. You are trying to compare two different cuts, this is what I mean.

Also, noone needs to have perfect eyes to see that difference in thickness, just 2 eyes are enough. You appreciate that the thickness of the bark of a trunk can never be the same as the thickness of bark of a thinner branch.
- One of your cuts (with larger area) is just on the trunk, and tree needs to heal and bypass that area quickly in order not to lose energy, so tree may try to heal/cover that area quicker.
- Other cut (with smaller area) is just a cut of a thinner branch, and tree may not need to heal it quickly as there is no energy needed in that direction (of cut branch).
I would like to emphasize again that I am not trying to defeat your theory or whatever, I just try to say we should compare two idential cuts.

One more thing:
You know that the main purpose of using such pastes/sealants is to prevent infection or similar problems.
When you cut your finger with a knife; if you use a plaster you decrease risk of infection but healing period may become longer, but if you do not use a plaster, cut area can heal quicker as long as it is not infected Smile Ironic!

I hope I am clear now?
Also I would like to see if sealants have really such effect or not!?

Thanks
Taner

Sakaki
Member


Back to top Go down

Re: Wound sealant, cut paste etc. Experiences, advice and what (not) to do?

Post  drgonzo on Sat Apr 28, 2012 3:01 am

Neither cut is on the trunk of the tree they are both located on the same primary branch.

Let me say again I'm not trying to prove anything just sharing a photo,
-Jay

drgonzo
Member


Back to top Go down

Re: Wound sealant, cut paste etc. Experiences, advice and what (not) to do?

Post  Brett Summers on Sat Apr 28, 2012 9:35 am

coh wrote:OK, let me see if I can summarize to this point (based on this thread and previous threads on this and other forums):

1) Modern horticultural practice is to NOT seal wounds on trees in the landscape.

2) Some internationally-known bonsai growers apply this thinking to their bonsai and do not seal pruning wounds.

3) Some internationally-known bonsai growers continue to seal at least some of their pruning wounds.

4) Both groups claim that the procedure works for them.

Any questions? Smile

It may be more beneficial to write 3) as, Some internationally-known bonsai growers including Walter Pall continue to seal at least some of their pruning wounds.

Yes it does seem there is little use for this stuff in large trees. But it seems it does have some use in stopping wounds drying out in some applications in bonsai.
Yes it is a good idea to leave some of the branch to allow the tree to compartmentalise easier but in Bonsai we often need to be rid of the stumps (eventually). Yes the tar and other sealents traditionally used on large trees seem little help but are they the same as what we use. Yes a wound will usually not kill a tree but in bonsai ensuring that wound gets no bigger can be a big help to the design. Often in collecting and large wounds then it seems obvious it is not worth the trouble. But in many other instances it does seem to be worth the trouble.
Only a study that uses the products we use in the way we use them can say that it is no use. Even Walter the writer of this article states that he still finds a use for wound dressing/sealer. If some can find more uses for it I would not be surprised.
But yes saying it always has to be used is probably just as silly in my opinion.
Also In my opinion Linda is akin to wikipedia a great place to start but you need to think critically about what she states as it is clear to anyone that can think critically that without citations it is hard to take her word for the findings when at best her interpretation leans towards her premise at worst she even seems to contradict herself in article to article or whatever you want to call her writings.



Brett Summers
Member


Back to top Go down

Re: Wound sealant, cut paste etc. Experiences, advice and what (not) to do?

Post  will baddeley on Sat Apr 28, 2012 4:40 pm

I use cut paste on my trees but not so much to avoid infection, but to speed up the callousing effect and keep the area from drying out and drawing back. Grafters use tape and wax as a sealer for the same purpose don't they?

will baddeley
Member


Back to top Go down

Re: Wound sealant, cut paste etc. Experiences, advice and what (not) to do?

Post  63pmp on Mon Apr 30, 2012 3:57 am

I know this thread is kind of dead, but I can't help but think everyone is debating the wrong question with regards to wound sealents.

The question is not do they work, but rather, what does it do? And the only answer I know of is that it protects the cambium at the wound edge from dessication.

The tree itself is solely responsible for healing wounds, nothing you put on it will encourage it if it doesn't want to heal.

I know of three things (there may be others) that strongly influence wound healing.

1 The plant requires a physiological need for healing. An example of this is that a tree needs to grow new phloem and xylem tissue to supply a strongly growing branch/s above the wound. To develop enough vascular tissue to meet demand the plant has to grow new tissue over the wound.

2 Physical barriers that prevent wound healing. If some wood, say a stub of branch like a tiny jin, is left in the wound it will prevent the cambium from extending laterally over the wound. Even with strong demand from above for new wood, a short stump can prevent lateral callus from moving over the wound.

3 The plant has insufficient energy/health to distribute resources to growing callus over a wound. Insufficient sun, poor fertilizer regime, wiring, waterlogging, defoliation etc, all weaken a plant so that the extra resources usually required for healing are not available.


Regards

Paul

63pmp
Member


Back to top Go down

Re: Wound sealant, cut paste etc. Experiences, advice and what (not) to do?

Post  Sponsored content Today at 9:40 am


Sponsored content


Back to top Go down

Page 3 of 3 Previous  1, 2, 3

View previous topic View next topic Back to top


 
Permissions in this forum:
You cannot reply to topics in this forum