New Pot for Ginkgo

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New Pot for Ginkgo

Post  LSBonsai on Tue Mar 13, 2012 10:28 pm

I posted this tree awhile back and Russell C. said that the pot was "OK" but not ideal. I totally agreed. I believe that I found the perfect(?) pot on my recent trip to Japan. This tree is waking up over 1 month early, and I am on vacation, so I repotted it today.

I would appreciate anyone's comments on this change! I think the new pot will really make the fall colours pop.

More pictures and info are here.

Old pot


New pot


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new pot

Post  rhoeda on Tue Mar 13, 2012 11:08 pm

Wow, I think the new pot would look really good once the Gingkos' leaves come out. I love your Ginko tree bonsai.I just planted a Gingko tree last year in my yard.

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Re: New Pot for Ginkgo

Post  Russell Coker on Wed Mar 14, 2012 1:10 am



I think it's a really nice improvement! I've never understood why anyone would put a ginkgo in a cream pot, but to each his own I guess. Style and color really show off that pretty tree!

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Re: New Pot for Ginkgo

Post  fiona on Wed Mar 14, 2012 9:54 am

I'm really interested in your thread. I too have a shohin Ginkgo in a creamish/biscuit coloured pot and the discussion at an event at the weekend was that it needs to go into something different - in terms of both colour and also shape. It seems to me that you have done pretty much what was advised for my tree. I really like the transformation and think you will be proved right in the way it offsets the autumn colours.

I don't want to hijack the thread so I'm not going to post a pic here. If people want to, they can see my tree HERE. It's in the first pic - bottom left tree.

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Re: New Pot for Ginkgo

Post  Russell Coker on Wed Mar 14, 2012 12:54 pm



Can't wait to see what you come up with, Fi!

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Re: New Pot for Ginkgo

Post  fiona on Wed Mar 14, 2012 1:15 pm

Andy Stone Monkey is doing me some virtuals and I'm fairly certain a pot almost identical to Lakeshore's was what we had in mind. As it's a commissioned pot, the tree won't be repotted this year. Will let you see the pot I decide on though.

Anyway, I'm hijacking again.

Like the blog btw, LSBonsai.

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Re: New Pot for Ginkgo

Post  LSBonsai on Wed Mar 14, 2012 3:31 pm

fiona wrote:I'm really interested in your thread. I too have a shohin Ginkgo in a creamish/biscuit coloured pot and the discussion at an event at the weekend was that it needs to go into something different - in terms of both colour and also shape. It seems to me that you have done pretty much what was advised for my tree. I really like the transformation and think you will be proved right in the way it offsets the autumn colours.

I don't want to hijack the thread so I'm not going to post a pic here. If people want to, they can see my tree HERE. It's in the first pic - bottom left tree.

Thanks everyone for the discussion! Fiona, don't consider it highjacking as long as we are talking about pot selection for ginkgo Smile

Your tree is lovely and congrats on the award! I'm looking forward to seeing what Andy comes up with. His pots are beautiful and I am hoping to a get a few some day.

If you've watched Tony Tickle's first two "potter" videos, a conundrum arises for us. The first one highlights the quality and beauty of Andy's pots. The second, with John Pitt, discusses that age in a pot is paramount. I am starting to see what he means. If the pot I put this ginkgo in was shiny and brand new, I don't think I would be nearly as happy with the image. In fact, I have a similar pot by american potter Chuck Iker that I almost put this tree in, but the presence of patina sealed the deal for the Japanese pot. Old pots can be hard to find but there are some dealers on ebay who ship old pots from Japan at very reasonable prices. And paying a little extra makes sense when you are saving the 30 or so years of constant use that it takes for patina to start to appear on glazed pots!

Anyway, thanks for the comment!

p.s. is that a potentilla in the yellow pot in your shohin display? I love yellow pots Smile

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Re: New Pot for Ginkgo

Post  LSBonsai on Wed Mar 14, 2012 3:40 pm

Russell Coker wrote:

I think it's a really nice improvement! I've never understood why anyone would put a ginkgo in a cream pot, but to each his own I guess. Style and color really show off that pretty tree!

Thanks Russell Smile

As for why anyone puts ginkgo in cream pots... interesting question. I guess the same question could be applied to Japanese maples (or maybe not)? In Japan, it seems the majority of J maples and ginkgos are in cream or light blue pots. The reason for light blue is obvious, but why cream? I think it may be because the screaming contrast between the blue and the fall colour (be it bright yellow, bright red, whatever) may just be too much for some people's tastes. I can almost see this tree looking like Spongebob when fall comes around. The blue pot will give a very playful image, and the cream pot will give a more mature, refined image... maybe?

Anyway, I am still shopping around for a nicer cream pot that is similar in shape to the new blue one. I will probably alternate pots for this tree over the years to get the best of both worlds Smile


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Re: New Pot for Ginkgo

Post  fiona on Wed Mar 14, 2012 4:28 pm

It was a potentilla. Here it is in its yellow Stone Monkey pot:



It received a bit of criticism on the basis that the flowers are virtually the same colour as the pot and so would be overpoweringly yellow in season. It was also felt (and I agree) that the pot was too deep. It has subsequently been repotted into... yup, you guessed it - a blue oval. Very Happy





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Re: New Pot for Ginkgo

Post  Russell Coker on Thu Mar 15, 2012 1:44 am


LS, if I had a pretty little ginkgo like you and Fiona, I'd go full-on balls to the wall with something like this.

Walk on the wild side....


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Post  tap pi lu on Thu Mar 15, 2012 1:51 am

I think you should choose a rectangular pots, enamel texture and shoots you should bend swept down the pots

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Re: New Pot for Ginkgo

Post  LSBonsai on Thu Mar 15, 2012 3:27 am

Russell Coker wrote:
LS, if I had a pretty little ginkgo like you and Fiona, I'd go full-on balls to the wall with something like this.

Walk on the wild side....


Crazy! Thats the kind of pot I would put the tree in just to piss people off lol! Twisted Evil

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Re: New Pot for Ginkgo

Post  fiona on Thu Mar 15, 2012 5:04 am

tap pi lu wrote:I think you should choose a rectangular pots, enamel texture and shoots you should bend swept down the pots
At the moment I can't quite picture this. Do you mean style it like a larch or juniper with entire branches going downwards or just the tips? Can you do a virt or draw us what you mean?

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new speci

Post  tap pi lu on Thu Mar 15, 2012 8:14 am

you may think this idea is crazy, but it's true because from bonsai trees do not look old to impress people look at it Here is the outline

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Re: New Pot for Ginkgo

Post  fiona on Thu Mar 15, 2012 9:33 am

It's not crazy, but I personally wouldn't go for that. I don't generally subscribe to the "it doesn't grow like that in Nature" view when it comes to bonsai, although I am currently thinking it in this case.

I like both LSbonsai's Ginkgo and my own with the shape they currently have because they are that bit different from the usual bonsai one sees - almost to the point of uniqueness. Even his and mine, although similar in form, are sufficiently different to have that uniqueness. I always think of the flames of a fire when I look at mine and that is enhanced dramatically when it takes on its autumn colours. It is for that reason in particular that I wouldn't change its shape at all.

But everyone to his or her own.


On the plus side, your idea for a rectangular pot would fit with the tree that shape but you'd lose the effect of the wonderful autumn colour with a pot of that shade IMHO.

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Re: New Pot for Ginkgo

Post  Mark Cooper on Thu Mar 15, 2012 9:48 am

Blue works with autumn foliage ...... Ginkgo at Taikan-ten 2011


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Re: New Pot for Ginkgo

Post  Rob Kempinski on Thu Mar 15, 2012 11:23 am

fiona wrote:It's not crazy, but I personally wouldn't go for that. I don't generally subscribe to the "it doesn't grow like that in Nature" view when it comes to bonsai, although I am currently thinking it in this case.


Really old Gingkos can grow like the virtual. Here is a photo of a 750 year old Gingko tree at at temple in Kyoto. Lots of sagging horizontal branches. Flame shape long since gone. However, one can style a tree anyway they want - using natural forms or not.


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Re: New Pot for Ginkgo

Post  Russell Coker on Thu Mar 15, 2012 11:52 am

LSBonsai wrote:
Russell Coker wrote:
Walk on the wild side....


Crazy! Thats the kind of pot I would put the tree in just to piss people off lol! Twisted Evil

Well, with smal, especially shohin, bonsai you can get away with a lot. Of course any blue "works", but isn't it almost expected? Mine is in a blue/green crackle glaze...

I think the yellow fall color would be drop dread with this purple glaze.

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Re: New Pot for Ginkgo

Post  fiona on Thu Mar 15, 2012 2:47 pm

Mark Cooper wrote:Blue works with autumn foliage ...... Ginkgo at Taikan-ten 2011

This I like and it is rather what i envisage for my own. I like the lip on that pot too, although I also like the smooth line of LSBonsai's.

Mark, am I right in saying that at the weekend you mentioned a more feminine image would be created by the oval pot? If so, is that what LSBonsai's tree has achieved?

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Re: New Pot for Ginkgo

Post  LSBonsai on Thu Mar 15, 2012 3:09 pm

tap pi lu wrote:you may think this idea is crazy, but it's true because from bonsai trees do not look old to impress people look at it Here is the outline

Its funny you mention this design... when I first got this tree 4 years ago it was a stump with thin random branches. Marco Invernizzi saw it at a workshop and instructed me to tie down all of the branches to go for a design similar to yours. I did, but didn't like the bowed look of the branches. and after a year they weren't remotely close to holding in place.

Then I realized there is a reason why 90% of ginkos are styled like this... its because thats the way the tree want's to grow. Its easier for both tree and owner, and still makes a pleasing image I think.

Thanks for the discussion Very Happy

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Re: New Pot for Ginkgo

Post  LSBonsai on Thu Mar 15, 2012 3:12 pm

Russell Coker wrote:
LSBonsai wrote:
Russell Coker wrote:
Walk on the wild side....


Crazy! Thats the kind of pot I would put the tree in just to piss people off lol! Twisted Evil

Well, with smal, especially shohin, bonsai you can get away with a lot. Of course any blue "works", but isn't it almost expected? Mine is in a blue/green crackle glaze...

I think the yellow fall color would be drop dread with this purple glaze.

I would definitely not be afraid to try it out for a year if I had the pot. But personally I wouldn't buy the pot unless it was cheap. Which I doubt it is... I think thats been on ebay for a long time if I'm not mistaken.

BTW my tree is about 12" from the soil line... should have mentioned that.

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Re: New Pot for Ginkgo

Post  Russell Coker on Thu Mar 15, 2012 7:36 pm



Well, thank God you didn't follow Marco Invernizzi's advice. I think you've done a really nice job. The only thing I'd really change is the length of the branches. You have to cut them back short and regrow ramification. Take a good look at that tree Mark posted.

Yes, this is a really good pot and a really expensive pot. You only buy cheap pots? Good bonsai deserve good pots.

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Re: New Pot for Ginkgo

Post  LSBonsai on Thu Mar 15, 2012 8:21 pm

Russell Coker wrote:

Well, thank God you didn't follow Marco Invernizzi's advice. I think you've done a really nice job. The only thing I'd really change is the length of the branches. You have to cut them back short and regrow ramification. Take a good look at that tree Mark posted.

Yes, this is a really good pot and a really expensive pot. You only buy cheap pots? Good bonsai deserve good pots.

Nooo I'm not afraid to spend money on pots. I appreciate the value of a fine bonsai pot. However, I will only drop the cash if it is a pot that I really love... and if its versatile. I don't buy weird pots so I can put them on a shelf and look at them.

What I've been trying to do for the ramification is working on getting the backbuds to extend. Typically only the apical shoot on a branch will extend, while the backbuds will just put out leaves and a new bud. Last year the tree was finally strong enough that by cutting back the apical shoot, some of the backbuds would extend into new shoots, effectively doubling my ramification. If I can continue this process for 10 or so years, I think the ramification will improve. This year, however, I will probably cut it back a bit harder. Maybe not as hard as you are thinking, though.

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Re: New Pot for Ginkgo

Post  William N. Valavanis on Thu Mar 15, 2012 9:14 pm

Sorry I personally do not like the new blue pot for your ginkgo bonsai. To me the pot is too small, too shallow and the clay walls are not thick enough. The thickness of the pot is very important when selecting an appropriate pot.

But I do like the blue color.

Bill

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Re: New Pot for Ginkgo

Post  LSBonsai on Thu Mar 15, 2012 10:04 pm

William N. Valavanis wrote:Sorry I personally do not like the new blue pot for your ginkgo bonsai. To me the pot is too small, too shallow and the clay walls are not thick enough. The thickness of the pot is very important when selecting an appropriate pot.

But I do like the blue color.

Bill

Thanks Bill, I appreciate your honest critique. Pots that are too thick walled have bothered me in the past... but I've never really picked out thin walls as an issue. I am still pretty happy with the pot, but now that you've pointed these things out, I can't help but notice them Smile Maybe by next year these issues will be driving me crazy and the pot will be gone.

From a horticultural perspective, I am a bit concerned about the watering requirements this tree might have in this new pot.

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Re: New Pot for Ginkgo

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