I am a total novice... so advice please and pointers. ( i do know a lot about them)

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I am a total novice... so advice please and pointers. ( i do know a lot about them)

Post  Guest on Sat Feb 18, 2012 7:16 pm

I have been in love with bonsai for a while now. But didn't really want to get into it until... my very pretty
Tangerine tree started to die. about a month ago i noticed my 3 going on four year old Tree was starting to die... and i was the one who ate the tangerine that produced the seed that grew into this tree so naturally i am attached to the poor thing.... The reason why it was kicking the bucket because it needed a new pot... i couldn't find a bigger size nor had the money for one at the time. So i remembered bonsai's and how they are kept small and in the same pot.

So i pruned the tree... and root pruned my poor thing placing him in the same pot with some new soil and some fertilizer ( my secret blend what will bring any citrus tree from the brink of death with in weeks)... and poof to let me know how happy it was it kinda went on a leaf and branch binj... which awesome.

So far hear is my tangerine tree ( one month after incident)
as you can see its about 3 feet or so tall.

Here is the angles of the trunk i like



I also have an Avocado plant...

My little plant took forever and a day to sprout...
Its a year and two months old ( and has been in the same container for a year)
I am very skilled at growing these little guys... yes i know large big leaves... considering the leaves are now smaller in size then what they have been... the fact that it is growling slower then slow now... and the fact that its not root bound yet ( i have my secret method of stunting the root growth or promoting it in my seedlings and older trees)
Here are some picks of him. ( hes only a little over a foot tall right now)



Yes i know Avocados are not suitable for the bonsai treatment due to tender roots large leaves yadda yadda.
But i have my hopes up for this little guy due to one fact... its starting to get branch nodes... he he that and this little tree has had its roots conditioned... in fact its been out side for about i would say and hr in sub freezing weather ( moving) and survived that with flying colors with out the single hint that it suffered any.
Also the roots on this have been trimmed once and trained to grow in a spiral.

So tips.. questions... advice on these guys is wanted.... i also have several apple trees i plan on turning Japanese LOl


Last edited by wolfHhowling on Sun Feb 19, 2012 7:15 pm; edited 1 time in total

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Re: I am a total novice... so advice please and pointers. ( i do know a lot about them)

Post  Orion on Sat Feb 18, 2012 8:16 pm

Interesting materials, but the Avocado takes the cake Shocked I imagine that just about anything can be adapted to pot culture; what are their growth characteristics-tall, short, leggy...? As far as the tangerine, I would imagine that you would follow the same methods as, for example, a lemon. Have you searched the archives here? If you haven't, click the "search" icon above and just type in "citrus", or something like that, and see what gives. I guess at some point you got to make some decisions on the tangerine especially when you have to sacrifice flower and fruit for cutting back the branches and deciding on a style.

FWIW, I've never done either, but I'm sure there's at least someone here who has a tried a tangerine.

p.s. I checked out both "citrus" and "orange" sorry no tangerine, in the search database here and there some good info you may want to check out...there are more than a few here how can give you some great tips on fruit trees.

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Re: I am a total novice... so advice please and pointers. ( i do know a lot about them)

Post  Nemphis on Sat Feb 18, 2012 8:37 pm

I like the Avocado.It's so nice.

About the tangerine you could do an air-layering and you could get two 50 cm nice pre-bonsai trees.

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Re: I am a total novice... so advice please and pointers. ( i do know a lot about them)

Post  Guest on Sat Feb 18, 2012 8:42 pm

Orion wrote:Interesting materials, but the Avocado takes the cake Shocked I imagine that just about anything can be adapted to pot culture; what are their growth characteristics-tall, short, leggy...? As far as the tangerine, I would imagine that you would follow the same methods as, for example, a lemon. Have you searched the archives here? If you haven't, click the "search" icon above and just type in "citrus", or something like that, and see what gives. I guess at some point you got to make some decisions on the tangerine especially when you have to sacrifice flower and fruit for cutting back the branches and deciding on a style.

FWIW, I've never done either, but I'm sure there's at least someone here who has a tried a tangerine.

A tangerine tree is more like the orange tree... and so i have been looking at specimens of them. So far very conflicted info.

As for the tangerine... it probably will never fruit and or flower... so not a big issue... and even if it did.. i still would have lots of flowers no matter what shape i put it in.

As for the Avocado tree
The tree grows very rapidly till it reaches 80 feat tall on average. its a large robust tree that can and will pull up rock even cracking it with its roots. ( if it doesn't get enough water)
my tree is a hass/ something other then a hass... witch means if not bonsai it will reach the 80 feat rather quickly... its not a dawrf by any means so Smile Very Happy on that. considering that it should at least by double it height or more. in 5 to 6 years it should be 10 to 20 feat and producing fruit...

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Re: I am a total novice... so advice please and pointers. ( i do know a lot about them)

Post  Guest on Sun Feb 19, 2012 5:09 pm

I also have a few apple tree seedlings... no pics for them as of yet...

two of witch are i would say all most a foot tall... there trunks are pretty odd and twig like... i have two of those. one has his trunk in a perfect L bend... and the other well i don't know what its trying to prove? They got quite a few leaves... and seem to want to branch. ( i think there Gala apples) there both in the same pot. Leaves are not getting any ware near the half way mark. ( for normal apple)

that being said i also have three little apple trees no bigger then i say three inches.... one wants to do calligraphy with its trunk ( so kinda going to make sure the trunk keeps its shape.. i like it.) the other did another perfect L bend i don't get that... and one is trying its hardest to grow poker straight.... (eh) there trunks all are thiner then the big ones... and they only have 4 to 6 leaves.... right now there in small containers... there favoring smaller leaves ( half the size of the bigger guys)

Got to ask.... do i jump on the fact that there stunting there own growth? and start with wires and god only knows what to keep them bonsai material for later ( when older)... or just let them go? and then go the way of wires and other stuffs.

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Re: I am a total novice... so advice please and pointers. ( i do know a lot about them)

Post  JimLewis on Sun Feb 19, 2012 6:21 pm

Buying trees just takes the fun out of it.

Maybe, but it does save a lot of time. The trees you've shown (and all "seedlings") take many years to turn into bonsai. The "art" in bonsai is the ability to create aged-looking trees.

We've all planted seeds, but we (or most of us) also have adult trees to work with while we wait.

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Re: I am a total novice... so advice please and pointers. ( i do know a lot about them)

Post  Guest on Sun Feb 19, 2012 6:51 pm

true but however....
I prefer starting from seeds ... each plant has its own persona... and the only way to get to know what your little tree is capable of is if you grow them from seeds having a while to get to know the trees personality.. makes a better bonsai. in my opinion.

For the art of the bonsai is in fact to get mature looking trees witch depending on the tree may or may not take that long of a time to achieve ( growth rate).

how ever it is in the art of the bonsai to work with the tree making its natural strength and grace shine through, its not to force your will on the plant but to enhance the plant... if it wants to grow left.. and you want it to grow right... and make it do so that is not the art of the bonsai.

I was asking about the seedlings because i wish to train them now instead of later when its much more invasive for the plant. when a new branch comes and its green and all new and ply able... then you can work with it once it is hardened i feel you have two options leave it or chop it.

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Re: I am a total novice... so advice please and pointers. ( i do know a lot about them)

Post  marcus watts on Mon Feb 20, 2012 7:25 pm

I agree wolf that it can be much easier to work with a tree than against it sometimes, but to make a harmonious bonsai tree does need a persons will and inner strength imposing on the tree to make it appear large and mature but still be small in size.

I'd really like to see some of the trees you started from seeds many years ago - they must be really nice now?

cheers
Marcus

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Re: I am a total novice... so advice please and pointers. ( i do know a lot about them)

Post  Poink88 on Mon Feb 20, 2012 8:33 pm

JMHO but both of your trees (avocado and tangerine) are not the best species for bonsai. Sure it can be done but it will be a long and hard one...and in the end you might not have much to show for all your time and effort. Just like your belief of letting the tree tell you what it wants...these trees (as well as all the avocados and tangerines before them) are probably telling you they are not for bonsai. Wink It is your time so do as you please.

BTW, I hope your avocado's glass pot have a drain hole. Wink

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Re: I am a total novice... so advice please and pointers. ( i do know a lot about them)

Post  Guest on Mon Feb 20, 2012 8:56 pm

Nope its a fish tank.

And it has good cactus soil. i only water it once a week or so... when it lets me know hey mom i need water. other then it its fine... its lived in the same pot its whole life 1 year and 2 months. all though i am looking for a stone pot.. because all other pots will be shattered in a few more years.. ( the root system)

And tangerine trees can be turned into bonsai they make exquisite bonsai. ( see internet photos of Bonsai growers in India and japan.) How ever mine... unlike there trees was let grow wild for way to long... and so now has 9 inch spikes known as thorns. so pruning is a delicate time consuming process. and its still young so eh.

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Re: I am a total novice... so advice please and pointers. ( i do know a lot about them)

Post  Guest on Mon Feb 20, 2012 9:01 pm

marcus watts wrote:I agree wolf that it can be much easier to work with a tree than against it sometimes, but to make a harmonious bonsai tree does need a persons will and inner strength imposing on the tree to make it appear large and mature but still be small in size.

I'd really like to see some of the trees you started from seeds many years ago - they must be really nice now?

cheers
Marcus

I would love to show you them... unfortunately i had to move cross states many times and had to give my pretties away. And sadly i have gotten reports back that all have died... one of witch was a 5 year old tree... a lemon no bigger then four feet high... they left it out side during the summer months of Arizona desert and so it was fried to a crisp. Needless to say i no longer talk to that family member.

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Re: I am a total novice... so advice please and pointers. ( i do know a lot about them)

Post  LSBonsai on Mon Feb 20, 2012 10:06 pm

wolfHhowling wrote:And tangerine trees can be turned into bonsai they make exquisite bonsai. ( see internet photos of Bonsai growers in India and japan.)

Citrus can definitely make nice bonsai, but it all depends on climate, as I am sure you know. In Japan and India they grow citrus outdoors all year round, and therefore have strong healthy plants to work with. Not to mention garden plants which can be dug up and grown for bonsai. I noticed you are in PA. I am in a similar climate and have been growing a Lemon for almost 8 years in a container. Needless to say it has been a slow process and I have nothing really to show for it. It was the first plant I ever bought for bonsai, and basically had no idea what I was doing. Now its just a houseplant that I am very attached to... not close to bonsai status. Otherwise I would have scrapped it years ago. I'm sure it would be twice as fat if I put it under lights during the winter, but I can't be bothered. In hindsight, I wish I had started with a hardy plant. But hey, you will probably get better results. Just sharing my story here.

Trunk is about 3/4 inch thick above the nebari, tree is about 12 inches tall.



Here is Kyuzo Murata's Orange. 50 years old and 22 inches at the time of this photograph. Don't expect to be able to achieve that in the same time in PA.



www.lakeshorebonsai.wordpress.com

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