Design Challenge - Sageretia theezans, Chinese Sweet Plum

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Design Challenge - Sageretia theezans, Chinese Sweet Plum

Post  Rob Kempinski on Mon Jan 09, 2012 11:19 pm

I picked up this fairly large Chinese Sweet Plum (Sageretia theezans) yesterday. It was a nursery plant that was left alone for over 17 years. It grew out of the holes in its original cylindrical nursery pot and into the ground. Then it grew sucker trunks and prop roots. Very wild.
I saw it as a potential raft, but it could even be tilted upright. Since there has been so much fun doing designs suggestions, I decided to do an offering like Robert Stephens did recently. Of designs submitted within the next week I will give a surprise award at my expense to what I feel is the best use of the material. Sketches, virtual designs, claymation, or whatever you desire - give me some ideas. Multiple submissions are ok.

Here are several views to work with. It is in a cement mixing tub that is 24 inches (61cm) across. The long part that is buried is about 18 inches across (46 cm). From front to back the tree is 16 inches (41 cm).
The tree has small leaves, great back budding ability, the wood carves well and the exfoliating bark is kind of cool. It grows branches very quickly but they take a long while to bulk up. It's a very popular species at Chinese exhibitions.
The tallest straight part is dead.
View A

View B - the narrow side of the mixing tub


View C from full length of the mixing tray


View D another potential view


View E from a different angle - depth of field caused a bit of blurriness - sorry about that.


View F Close up of the base.


Have fun. Thanks.

Rob Kempinski
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Re: Design Challenge - Sageretia theezans, Chinese Sweet Plum

Post  Guest on Tue Jan 10, 2012 3:17 am

Ahem! Ahem! Wink

I am enjoying this forum more...Though I am busy preparing for Robert's upcoming visit here. I'll spend some extra time for this one..hehehe! For the sake of bonsai spirit of course and not for the bounty....(just kidding, who cares about the bonsai spirit. hehehe)! Suspect Suspect Suspect


Are the pros like Robert qualified for this Rob? Very Happy


regards,
jun Smile

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Re: Design Challenge - Sageretia theezans, Chinese Sweet Plum

Post  Rob Kempinski on Tue Jan 10, 2012 4:35 am

jun wrote:Ahem! Ahem! Wink

Are the pros like Robert qualified for this Rob? Very Happy


regards,
jun Smile

Sure. Bring it on.



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Re: Design Challenge - Sageretia theezans, Chinese Sweet Plum

Post  Todd Ellis on Tue Jan 10, 2012 4:40 am

Rob, this looks like a fun project; my kind of material!

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Re: Design Challenge - Sageretia theezans, Chinese Sweet Plum

Post  Robert Steven on Tue Jan 10, 2012 1:32 pm

jun wrote:Ahem! Ahem! Wink

I am enjoying this forum more...Though I am busy preparing for Robert's upcoming visit here. I'll spend some extra time for this one..hehehe! For the sake of bonsai spirit of course and not for the bounty....(just kidding, who cares about the bonsai spirit. hehehe)! Suspect Suspect Suspect


Are the pros like Robert qualified for this Rob? Very Happy


regards,
jun Smile

Hei Jun, don't use my visit for excuse... Evil or Very Mad
Ya, still many people care more for bonsai politic rather than bonsai spirit... pale

Whatever..for the sake of the reward, I will try to participate...Not sure to win, but give a try... Laughing

BTW, Rob, is that peeling trunk dead ? and is it easily expected to get new shoots from different points ?


Last edited by Robert Steven on Tue Jan 10, 2012 1:38 pm; edited 1 time in total (Reason for editing : mistype)

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Re: Design Challenge - Sageretia theezans, Chinese Sweet Plum

Post  Guest on Tue Jan 10, 2012 1:33 pm

Hi Rob.

I'll go first...

Before somebody else, specially the bonsai master from Indonesia submit a windswept... I present my idea.

Most of the straight branches will be removed....



regards,
jun Smile

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Re: Design Challenge - Sageretia theezans, Chinese Sweet Plum

Post  Robert Steven on Tue Jan 10, 2012 1:56 pm

Jess..it is much more complicated than I thought... drunken
Rob, is it possible for you to lift the whole piece from the pot and take pictures from different angles ? I am expecting something underground... tongue

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Re: Design Challenge - Sageretia theezans, Chinese Sweet Plum

Post  Guest on Tue Jan 10, 2012 2:15 pm

Hi guys,
Common Robert, There is no such word as "complicated" in your vocabulary, everybody knows that Razz Stop playing with us and show us your idea. bounce





2nd entry,

I lifted the whole tree, planted it sideways in a hollowed out rock (for softer rock, or squeezed the tree in two rocks for hard type of rocks)



regards,
jun Smile

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Re: Design Challenge - Sageretia theezans, Chinese Sweet Plum

Post  Sam Ogranaja on Tue Jan 10, 2012 2:32 pm

Thank you Robert, Rob and Jun for posting all the trees you've posted lately. I hope more people do the same. I am really enjoying all these design challenges. Very educational. I'm expecting Robert to do something in 3D. Now where did I put my Cyan glasses?

Have a great week everyone!!!
Sam

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Re: Design Challenge - Sageretia theezans, Chinese Sweet Plum

Post  Rob Kempinski on Tue Jan 10, 2012 4:22 pm

Robert Steven wrote:Jess..it is much more complicated than I thought... drunken
Rob, is it possible for you to lift the whole piece from the pot and take pictures from different angles ? I am expecting something underground... tongue

I will try to get more views including out of the pot.

Most of the trunk is alive, although the wood carves well and sharis can be made anywhere.
The tall straight skinny trunk is dead already most all other trunks are alive. It does bud back from cut stumps.

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Re: Design Challenge - Sageretia theezans, Chinese Sweet Plum

Post  Pavel Slovák on Tue Jan 10, 2012 6:04 pm

Hi Rob
A very interesting base for the tree. I am curious about further developments. Really like the first draft by Jun.

Gretings Pavel

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Re: Design Challenge - Sageretia theezans, Chinese Sweet Plum

Post  marcus watts on Tue Jan 10, 2012 6:33 pm

hi Rob,
this is a challenge and a half !! just one question, are there already roots in several places along the trunks please, or are they just concentrated down the 'fat' end.

cheers Marcus

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Re: Design Challenge - Sageretia theezans, Chinese Sweet Plum

Post  Rob Kempinski on Tue Jan 10, 2012 7:17 pm

marcus watts wrote:hi Rob,
this is a challenge and a half !! just one question, are there already roots in several places along the trunks please, or are they just concentrated down the 'fat' end.

cheers Marcus
All along the bottom. The majority of the roots are on the part near my hand. There is a natural bridge in the middle of the trunk.


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Re: Design Challenge - Sageretia theezans, Chinese Sweet Plum

Post  Rob Kempinski on Tue Jan 10, 2012 7:20 pm

Sam Ogranaja wrote:Thank you Robert, Rob and Jun for posting all the trees you've posted lately. I hope more people do the same. I am really enjoying all these design challenges. Very educational. I'm expecting Robert to do something in 3D. Now where did I put my Cyan glasses?

Have a great week everyone!!!
Sam

Sam - take a shot at a design.

Rob Kempinski
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Re: Design Challenge - Sageretia theezans, Chinese Sweet Plum

Post  Todd Ellis on Wed Jan 11, 2012 11:42 am

Hi Rob,
What kind of soil will you use to develop this tree?
Regarding style I tend to favor Jun's second picture; tree growing - clasping a rock (more) upright. The challenge will be to find the right rock. I also see this tree grown in a prostrated position exposing more of the roots; there has to been an animal in there somewhere. There's alot of lovely movement among the base and a couple of the trunks.
Todd

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Re: Design Challenge - Sageretia theezans, Chinese Sweet Plum

Post  Sam Ogranaja on Wed Jan 11, 2012 1:27 pm

Rob Kempinski wrote:
Sam Ogranaja wrote:Thank you Robert, Rob and Jun for posting all the trees you've posted lately. I hope more people do the same. I am really enjoying all these design challenges. Very educational. I'm expecting Robert to do something in 3D. Now where did I put my Cyan glasses?

Have a great week everyone!!!
Sam

Sam - take a shot at a design.

I'll take a shot at it. Rob, do you have a deadline? I'm supposed to go to the mountains of Boone this weekend.
Sam

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Re: Design Challenge - Sageretia theezans, Chinese Sweet Plum

Post  Rob Kempinski on Wed Jan 11, 2012 1:29 pm

Sam Ogranaja wrote:
Rob Kempinski wrote:
Sam Ogranaja wrote:Thank you Robert, Rob and Jun for posting all the trees you've posted lately. I hope more people do the same. I am really enjoying all these design challenges. Very educational. I'm expecting Robert to do something in 3D. Now where did I put my Cyan glasses?

Have a great week everyone!!!
Sam

Sam - take a shot at a design.

I'll take a shot at it. Rob, do you have a deadline? I'm supposed to go to the mountains of Boone this weekend.
Sam

I did earlier say a week, but what the hey.

Boone will probably be cold this weekend. have fun.


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Re: Design Challenge - Sageretia theezans, Chinese Sweet Plum

Post  Robert Steven on Wed Jan 11, 2012 1:35 pm

Thanks Rob.. I need sometimes as well as...I am on business trip now... Very Happy

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Re: Design Challenge - Sageretia theezans, Chinese Sweet Plum

Post  Rob Kempinski on Wed Jan 11, 2012 1:43 pm

Todd Ellis wrote:Hi Rob,
What kind of soil will you use to develop this tree?
The soil in the photo was just temporary left over nursery soil that we had at the nursery were we were "collecting" - cleaning up might be a better word.
It will get a mix of one part akadama, turface, sand blast sand, lava, and Miracle Grow potting soil when repotted (which will be soon).


Todd Ellis wrote:Hi Rob,

Regarding style I tend to favor Jun's second picture; tree growing - clasping a rock (more) upright. The challenge will be to find the right rock. I also see this tree grown in a prostrated position exposing more of the roots; there has to been an animal in there somewhere. There's alot of lovely movement among the base and a couple of the trunks.
Todd

There is a lot going on with this specimen. It brings up an interesting point. This was grown in a nursery yet it has as much character as a collected specimen from the woods/mountains and swamps (and better survival chances too). The section of this nursery was left unattended since 1994. Imagine if we had a nursery market in the USA (and other non-Asian markets) where farmers grew stuff like this for years in the fields. It would certainly reduce the pressure on the need to collect ancient specimens from the wild and make good material readily available for bonsai artists.

Alright Todd, lets see you design!

Rob Kempinski
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Re: Design Challenge - Sageretia theezans, Chinese Sweet Plum

Post  Rob Kempinski on Wed Jan 11, 2012 1:45 pm

Robert Steven wrote:Thanks Rob.. I need sometimes as well as...I am on business trip now... Very Happy

Patience is required for good bonsai. No problem.

Rob Kempinski
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Re: Design Challenge - Sageretia theezans, Chinese Sweet Plum

Post  Sam Ogranaja on Wed Jan 11, 2012 1:49 pm

Rob Kempinski wrote:There is a lot going on with this specimen. It brings up an interesting point. This was grown in a nursery yet it has as much character as a collected specimen from the woods/mountains and swamps (and better survival chances too). The section of this nursery was left unattended since 1994. Imagine if we had a nursery market in the USA (and other non-Asian markets) where farmers grew stuff like this for years in the fields. It would certainly reduce the pressure on the need to collect ancient specimens from the wild and make good material readily available for bonsai artists.

Alright Todd, lets see you design!

I agree completely Rob. I work with a local nurseryman who has a bunch of Japanese Maples that grew from the pots to the ground and have turned into a little forest. Unfortunately for me he plans on clearing it this spring so if there is anything worthy I'll have to dig it up before years of neglect but there just has to be other nurseries that have forgotten about stuff. How great to find this kind of material at a local nursery!!!!
Have a great week!!!
Sam

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Re: Design Challenge - Sageretia theezans, Chinese Sweet Plum

Post  Guest on Wed Jan 11, 2012 1:56 pm

.come on guys! I am also on a business trip right now.heheh Laughing e.
take your time.
...all you need is a peace of paper a pencil and a cellular phone. even high up in the mountain.it will work


Razz



regards
jun Very Happy

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Re: Design Challenge - Sageretia theezans, Chinese Sweet Plum

Post  Rob Kempinski on Wed Jan 11, 2012 1:59 pm

jun wrote:.come on guys! I am also on a business trip right now.heheh Laughing e.
take your time.
...all you need is a peace of paper a pencil and a cellular phone. even high up in the mountain.it will work


Razz



regards
jun Very Happy

That's the spirit!

Rob Kempinski
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Re: Design Challenge - Sageretia theezans, Chinese Sweet Plum

Post  Jesse on Wed Jan 11, 2012 2:56 pm

Wow, this is a challenging tree in my opinion. Far from the cookie cutter variety when it comes to designing it. I've been watching this since you posted it and giving it a bit of thought as to a direction as to what I would do with it....and I've got nothing. I do like the ones that Jun has posted thus far. Just surprised I can't have an have an original thought of my own, haha. I am excited to see what ideas are shared.

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Re: Design Challenge - Sageretia theezans, Chinese Sweet Plum

Post  Robert Steven on Wed Jan 11, 2012 3:25 pm

jun wrote:.come on guys! I am also on a business trip right now.heheh Laughing e.
take your time.
...all you need is a peace of paper a pencil and a cellular phone. even high up in the mountain.it will work


Razz



regards
jun Very Happy

Apart of that, I am also busy preparing my visit... BTW, I will use the original pictures for simulation for better authenticity... tongue Laughing

BTW, can you post another side of the off-pot picture, Rob ? Sorry, just pretend to be a pros.. Cool

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Re: Design Challenge - Sageretia theezans, Chinese Sweet Plum

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