Ugly callusing on Trident Maples

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Ugly callusing on Trident Maples

Post  shane martin on Thu Dec 01, 2011 12:36 pm

I have 3 Tridents in the ground about a meter from each other all showing the same ugly calluses on areas where branches or roots have been removed. There are other tridents amongst these 3, all about the same age, same soil conditions same everything really.
Out of around 20 advanced tridents all growing in the same area of the garden, these are the only ones with this affliction. Can anyone tell me what this is, and how to remidy the problem.
Thank you



Last edited by shane martin on Thu Dec 01, 2011 12:50 pm; edited 1 time in total

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Re: Ugly callusing on Trident Maples

Post  shane martin on Thu Dec 01, 2011 12:54 pm

JimLewis wrote:I see you tried to post an image (which would help). If you are having problems, read out tutorial on posting images.
Hi Jim,
Yes,,, just trying to get a handle on this forums image posting procedure. Much more complicated than I am used too. I was using the tutorial, but it kept trying to post the same image over and over. Finally got a result, and left it at 2 pics, not 5 as i'd intended.
cheers

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Re: Ugly callusing on Trident Maples

Post  EdMerc on Thu Dec 01, 2011 1:44 pm

I'm no expert on Maples or tree diseases, but my first reaction was to think it's some type of gall.

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Re: Ugly callusing on Trident Maples

Post  Sam Ogranaja on Thu Dec 01, 2011 3:38 pm

EdMerc wrote:I'm no expert on Maples or tree diseases, but my first reaction was to think it's some type of gall.

I agree with Ed. My first reaction was maybe that it was crown gall. I got it on a ficus and I had to get rid of the tree and disinfect the pot with bleach water as a precaution. I hope that's not what it is because I've read that it's highly contagious to other plants.

Good luck with your plants and keep us posted!!!!
Sam

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Re: Ugly callusing on Trident Maples

Post  drgonzo on Thu Dec 01, 2011 4:36 pm

I agree with Sam this looks like crown Gall, caused by Agrobacterium tumefaciens, it probably entered through the pruning wounds, Possibly being spread by an infected pruning tool, either your saw that did the trunk reductions, or pruners.
theres not much that can be done, but I would hit ALL of my pruning tools with rubbing alcohol.
-Jay


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Re: Ugly callusing on Trident Maples

Post  Russell Coker on Thu Dec 01, 2011 5:11 pm

If you're not sealing those cuts, you should be. Also, I've been told that tridents heal over too quickly when large cuts are made in the spring and that sometimes causes a thick, ugly callus. I think you'd be better off making those large cuts later in the season, cleaning the edges well with a sharp knife and sealing the cuts.

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Re: Ugly callusing on Trident Maples

Post  bucknbonsai on Thu Dec 01, 2011 6:57 pm

Russel, I have heard of (but dont know the details or EXACT location to cut) cutting the edge of the scar to keep it rolling inward. Does this keep the scars flatter or just keeps the callous growing?

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Re: Ugly callusing on Trident Maples

Post  Russell Coker on Thu Dec 01, 2011 7:53 pm

Sometimes when you make spring cuts the callus grows fairly the first year, then slows down. Taking a sharp knife and rewounding the inner edge of the callus the following spring can kinda jumpstart things again. But it is just to keep it growing.

Healthy tridents push so strongly in the spring that the callus can heal over too quickly, causing an ugly knob. Growth later in the summer or even early fall is much more restrained, and cuts heal much more attractively.

Here's the disclaimer: This info I pass along is what works for me, or what I've learned from others living here on the Coast. I have absolutely no idea if the same holds true for you or anyone else in other parts of the counrty and world.


Last edited by Russell Coker on Thu Dec 01, 2011 7:58 pm; edited 1 time in total (Reason for editing : added thought)

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Re: Ugly callusing on Trident Maples

Post  Bob Pressler on Thu Dec 01, 2011 8:04 pm

Love the disclaimer.

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Re: Ugly callusing on Trident Maples

Post  shane martin on Fri Dec 02, 2011 12:20 am

drgonzo wrote:I agree with Sam this looks like crown Gall, caused by Agrobacterium tumefaciens, it probably entered through the pruning wounds, Possibly being spread by an infected pruning tool, either your saw that did the trunk reductions, or pruners.
theres not much that can be done, but I would hit ALL of my pruning tools with rubbing alcohol.
-Jay

Thanks Jay.... In theory what you all have said makes absolute sense, and I totally agree that it's possibly the problem AND infected tools were the cause.
However.... I have a little more info I am going to share, which will throw some doubt into the equation.

Ashamedly I have to confess I rarely, if ever sterilise my tools. I know that will infuriate some purists, but I'm lazy in that respect, and being 100% truthful.
These cuts were made some 2-3 years ago, and since then I have used the same unsterilised tools on hundreds of occasions on all my other trees without affecting another tree. I also would have done the same procedure to the other 15 tridents in the same growing bed, but like I said, there are only 3 trees with this problem.

Can I carve the affected areas and treat with anything? or will it just return?
Russell, What do you use to seal these types of cuts?
I have never sealed large cuts like this, in 20 years of growing material in the ground.... I always slant the cut rather than flat horizontal ones, as I don't like the idea of water pooling on top, and if I see a hint of something not right down the track, I will treat "that" wound with household bleach, which normally does the job.
I'm not saying you shouldn't.....
It was just something I was told by an elder nurseryman many years ago.
My scars almost always heal over very flat, and are un noticeable when fully healed.
Too seal or not to seal????
Anyway people.... I hope this extra info will help solve this mystery, and look forward to your replies.
Footnote: I promise to try and carry some rubbing alcohol or bleach around with me in future to clean my tools......
Thanks everyone.

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Re: Ugly callusing on Trident Maples

Post  drgonzo on Fri Dec 02, 2011 12:33 am

The interesting thing about tree galls is they generally have a specific appearance for each of the different individual causes. An insect gail looks one way, a gall caused by a mites another way, fungal, viral and bacterial galls also can be distinguished by appearance (usually). This to my eyes looks like a bacterial gall, your tools may or may not have spread it so don't blame yourself Very Happy

I must confess I don't sterilize my tools as often as I should, but I do try to do it if I'm doing any work to trees I have up in the woods, and whenever I go from tree to tree in my orchard.

Its best practice in my experience to seal any cut larger than a pencil diameter and to always seal trunk reduction cuts. I use Tightbond III, even though I have good Japanese cut paste, it seems I still always use the Tightbond.
-Jay

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Re: Ugly callusing on Trident Maples

Post  AlainK on Fri Dec 02, 2011 12:40 am

Hello,

To me, that looks like an environmental problem :

- the roots in the last photo look like spider's legs and the part above looks anemic : bad soil, bad weather (both too dry, and the soil too compact)

- needs more oxygen in the roots and moisture above...


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Re: Ugly callusing on Trident Maples

Post  bucknbonsai on Fri Dec 02, 2011 2:15 am

shane, the 3rd photo in your first post, I would look into spitting a couple of those fat/fused roots and placing a rock in between or twine to pull apart then bury a little deeper for a year.

drgonzo- I just started using tightbond III this year as well and was very happy with how it looked initially, however it seems if the soil is very moist that any wood near the soil wicks up moisture and it travels under the tightbond making it very yellow/white chalky looking. Also when the temp is cold the glue rather than being invisible becomes opaque like a glazed doughnut, which looks HORRIBLE. How do you deal with these problems. Have you ever used wood hardener instead?
thanks

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Re: Ugly callusing on Trident Maples

Post  AlainK on Fri Dec 02, 2011 4:34 am

bucknbonsai wrote:
(...) Also when the temp is cold (...)

Byron Bay : average temperatures from 11.7° C to 27.6

http://www.bom.gov.au/climate/averages/tables/cw_058009.shtml

Tennessee : average temperatures from 4° C to 28

http://www.city-data.com/states/Tennessee-Climate.html

"The record high temperature for the state is 113°F (45°C), set at Perryville on 9 August 1930; the record low, –32°F (–36°C), was registered at Mountain City on 30 December 1917."

NTSC

(not totally the same climate Cool ...)

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Re: Ugly callusing on Trident Maples

Post  bucknbonsai on Fri Dec 02, 2011 4:47 am

I was not referring to some strange extreme cold, I noticed it back in october when it started getting down into the upper 40s and 50s, which is bothersome because the trees are still on display and have great fall color then. thanks

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Re: Ugly callusing on Trident Maples

Post  drgonzo on Fri Dec 02, 2011 5:07 am

AlainK wrote:
bucknbonsai wrote:
(...) Also when the temp is cold (...)

Byron Bay : average temperatures from 11.7° C to 27.6

http://www.bom.gov.au/climate/averages/tables/cw_058009.shtml

Tennessee : average temperatures from 4° C to 28

http://www.city-data.com/states/Tennessee-Climate.html

"The record high temperature for the state is 113°F (45°C), set at Perryville on 9 August 1930; the record low, –32°F (–36°C), was registered at Mountain City on 30 December 1917."

NTSC

(not totally the same climate Cool ...)

I believe Bucknbonsai he was talking to me in that post... Penn Yan NY... USDA Zone 5b

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Re: Ugly callusing on Trident Maples

Post  marcus watts on Fri Dec 02, 2011 7:05 am

hi,

cut into one of the galls and see the structure - see if it is made up of 'burr' like twisted knarled but solid wood or if it has holes,ants, mites, soft stuff. if the wood is solid and just like a burr i'd work with it and actually create a tree trunk with some character - you have a pile of similar tridents sat there so a little variety would be more interesting to work with.- after 2 or 3 tridents basically the same you'd be quite bored with them i imagine

i will also confess to never once sterilising any tools - in about 24 yrs of bonsai. I can only look at my current collection of course, but they seem very happy. what is rubbing alchohol ? would vodka work ?? Very Happy

cheers marcus

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Re: Ugly callusing on Trident Maples

Post  hin175 on Fri Dec 02, 2011 8:21 am

Vodka is only for sterilising bonsaika Very Happy

I think you should cut the "galls" and wound properly... It's safer for me Rolling Eyes

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Re: Ugly callusing on Trident Maples

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