Rafting Penjing

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Rafting Penjing

Post  Robert Steven on Wed Nov 30, 2011 2:51 pm

You might have seen this rafting premna on my second book which was taken 3 years ago..and this is how it looks today. Every day is getting better since I started from the scratch about 6 years ago...
Still working on the ramification to reduce the leaves size...



Close-up on the deadwood base..




This was about 3 years ago...



..and this was how it started...


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Re: Rafting Penjing

Post  PROTONWIRA on Wed Nov 30, 2011 2:56 pm

I love it, Robert !
Thanks for share
Rgds/ Quí

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Re: Rafting Penjing

Post  my nellie on Wed Nov 30, 2011 2:58 pm

This is Vision!!!

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Re: Rafting Penjing

Post  caycanhvn2012 on Wed Nov 30, 2011 4:35 pm

thank you,your penjing is so nice. Razz

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Re: Rafting Penjing

Post  Gentleman G. on Wed Nov 30, 2011 6:23 pm

WOW!!! Shocked That's amazing! I can only hope to have something this beautiful one day... Oh, by the way, I've found a source for Premna here in the U.S.!

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Re: Rafting Penjing

Post  luc tran on Wed Nov 30, 2011 6:37 pm

It looks amazing.

Luc

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Re: Rafting Penjing

Post  kimo on Wed Nov 30, 2011 9:23 pm

beautiful work!!!! ...from a piece of driftwood.


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Re: Rafting Penjing

Post  Robert Steven on Thu Dec 01, 2011 2:40 am

Thanks buddies....

Gentleman G. wrote:WOW!!! Shocked That's amazing! I can only hope to have something this beautiful one day... Oh, by the way, I've found a source for Premna here in the U.S.!
Really ?..where..in the nature or ...?

Kimo, it's not a drfitwood, it's alive with partly deadwood. It used to be a cascade bonsai which was dying, I got it from my friend's garden when he was about to burn it...


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Re: Rafting Penjing

Post  Sam Ogranaja on Thu Dec 01, 2011 1:51 pm

Robert Steven wrote:Kimo, it's not a drfitwood, it's alive with partly deadwood. It used to be a cascade bonsai which was dying, I got it from my friend's garden when he was about to burn it...


Great vision and execution, saving that from the burn pile to where it is today.
Have a great week!!!
Sam

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Re: Rafting Penjing

Post  Robert Steven on Thu Dec 01, 2011 2:12 pm

Thanks Sam, I always believe that EVERY material can turn into nice bonsai...

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Re: Rafting Penjing

Post  caycanhvn2012 on Thu Dec 01, 2011 2:20 pm

Robert Steven wrote:Thanks Sam, I always believe that EVERY material can turn into nice bonsai...
get something from nothing,thank you. santa

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Re: Rafting Penjing

Post  Robert Steven on Thu Dec 01, 2011 2:37 pm

Some of you may have seen this Pemphis on my first book. It was also started from scretch, I will take the new picture of how it looks like now...





Last edited by Robert Steven on Fri Dec 02, 2011 3:11 am; edited 1 time in total (Reason for editing : mistype)

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Re: Rafting Penjing

Post  Gentleman G. on Thu Dec 01, 2011 5:08 pm

No, the source I've found isn't growing wild. I've found a retailer selling what I would assume are rooted cuttings? Since I plan on growing it/them out to use as "Mother trees", this is fine with me. I wish I could walk outside and find a specimen even close to the stunning examples I've seen here, but that's not gonna happen any time soon Sad I do however have some friends and family that own ranches (Ranch owners, in Texas???? Nahhhhh) , and I've been given permission to collect! There are Elms, Oaks, and Cedar that I know of... I've even seen quite a few "winged bark" Elms too. No Premna though No

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Re: Rafting Penjing

Post  Russell Coker on Thu Dec 01, 2011 5:21 pm

G.,

USDA list Premna odorata in Miami-Dade county. The one you are most likely to find is P. japonica, Musk Maple.

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Re: Rafting Penjing

Post  Gentleman G. on Thu Dec 01, 2011 5:29 pm

The source I've found is in Fl., and is listed as Premna Sp. Is this not the same?

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Re: Rafting Penjing

Post  Russell Coker on Thu Dec 01, 2011 7:45 pm

P. odorata is a non-native in south Florida. From the images I see it looks like the foliage is pretty big, but from what I've seen on this forum Premna foliage reduces dramatically. I have no idea which species is/are being used by Robert and others in SE Asia. I would assume (but we know that's not a safe thing to do) that any bonsai outfit selling Premna here would be selling P. japonica. Is that the same as "Premna sp."? I have no idea. For years (and by that I mean 25 years ago) there have been "musk maples" floating around, but no one seemed to know what exactly they were. The leaves are small and look like trident maples, but stink when bruised. Does the nursery have pictures or a description, and use "musk maple" as a common name?

P. japonica has leaves about as big as my thumb in the ground, but they reduced down to fingernail size in a pot. It's also cold hardy, at least here in our part of the South. And that, my friend, is EVERYTHING I know about Premnas!

P.S. Sorry for the hijack Robert. And as always, I love seeing your work!

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Re: Rafting Penjing

Post  Robert Steven on Fri Dec 02, 2011 3:08 am

Russell Coker wrote:P. odorata is a non-native in south Florida. From the images I see it looks like the foliage is pretty big, but from what I've seen on this forum Premna foliage reduces dramatically. I have no idea which species is/are being used by Robert and others in SE Asia. I would assume (but we know that's not a safe thing to do) that any bonsai outfit selling Premna here would be selling P. japonica. Is that the same as "Premna sp."? I have no idea. For years (and by that I mean 25 years ago) there have been "musk maples" floating around, but no one seemed to know what exactly they were. The leaves are small and look like trident maples, but stink when bruised. Does the nursery have pictures or a description, and use "musk maple" as a common name?

P. japonica has leaves about as big as my thumb in the ground, but they reduced down to fingernail size in a pot. It's also cold hardy, at least here in our part of the South. And that, my friend, is EVERYTHING I know about Premnas!

P.S. Sorry for the hijack Robert. And as always, I love seeing your work!

There are more than 200 species of Premna, but not all can be used for bonsai, some leaves can't be reduced. The one used in Taiwan is P. mycrophilla (see the "A" on below picture) and we use P. serratifolia in Indonesia. We have about 7 species available in Indonesia, but I can't identify the botanical names. The different species of Premna are still confusing, some call the P. mycrophilla as P. naoseose.

P. odorata seems to be one of the availbale species in Indonesia with very strong odour, but it's not suitable for bonsai because the leaves are too thin, soft and can't be reduced. Usually people use the leaves for cooking seafood to get off the fishy smell.




Re. P. japonica. Here I got from Google with the description " Family: Verbenacées Kind: Premna Feature : The Premna kind includes several species, the most known and the more used in bonsaï is the Premna japonica. Original of Japan one meets it at the wild state in the south of dyes it and of taiwan, the Premna japonica is a tree reaching a maximum height of two meters. The Premna named japonica (in Japanese nioi kaede) to wrong in French (maple of burger to fragrant wood), in English (acer buergerianum musk scented). His/her/its particular and very recognizable odor from where his/her/its name" to fragrant wood ". Small alternate leaves green, deciduous, brilliant of shape similar to the maple of burger, becoming yellow in fall. White flowers of one millimeter in clusters blooming during the summer leaving place to fruits of the size of a purplish peppercorn. "
I have never seen this beforre and lloks like the odour is on the wood and not on the leaves like premna (?)


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Re: Rafting Penjing

Post  jrodriguez on Fri Dec 02, 2011 11:30 am

Russell,

Most Premna trees available in Florida came from Puerto Rico as rooted cuttings from Indonesia and Taiwan. Most are P. microphylla and several P. serratifolia.

Robert,

I have seen Premna japonica in person. The picture you post features leaves that have already been reduced. When untreated, they are larger than Microphylla and Serratifolia and issue a hideous smell when touched. I frankly do not understand why they call them Musk Maple. They really smell like a combination of Malathion and Lime Sulfur. Quite strong and disgusting!!! No matter how beautiful the tree is, the smell alone has made the decision for me: I will never own one of these!!!

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Re: Rafting Penjing

Post  Guest on Fri Dec 02, 2011 11:43 am

very nice landscape scene Robert.

I wonder what kind of Premma sub specie we got here.? I have a couple huge ones being developed. The dead wood are just to nice and I settled for huge trunk sizes, just in case the leaves doesn't reduce well. I think it is the letter B.

regards,
jun Smile





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Re: Rafting Penjing

Post  Robert Steven on Fri Dec 02, 2011 11:47 am

Send the close up leaves and let me see, Jun... I think we should have the similar kind...

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Re: Rafting Penjing

Post  Guest on Fri Dec 02, 2011 11:53 am

Hi Robert.

Thanks.
I think it is similar to what Hirow got in the other new thread. but I will post the photo later.

regards,
jun Smile

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Re: Rafting Penjing

Post  Russell Coker on Fri Dec 02, 2011 12:59 pm

jrodriguez wrote:Russell,

Most Premna trees available in Florida came from Puerto Rico as rooted cuttings from Indonesia and Taiwan. Most are P. microphylla and several P. serratifolia.

Robert,

I have seen Premna japonica in person. The picture you post features leaves that have already been reduced. When untreated, they are larger than Microphylla and Serratifolia and issue a hideous smell when touched. I frankly do not understand why they call them Musk Maple. They really smell like a combination of Malathion and Lime Sulfur. Quite strong and disgusting!!! No matter how beautiful the tree is, the smell alone has made the decision for me: I will never own one of these!!!

Thanks guys.

Robert, like JL says, that japonica picture is of greatly reduced foliage. The one I have in the ground has long, thin leaves about the size of my thumb.

I'm going to dig one at my parents' house this winter. I stuck it in the ground years ago as a cutting and forgot about it. Now it has the grace and beauty of a broomstick. I'll be doing a major "trunk chop", and I guess I'll cut the remainder into pieces and see if they root.

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Re: Rafting Penjing

Post  Robert Steven on Fri Dec 02, 2011 1:02 pm

Love to see Russell..but do you think it's in the Premna family ?

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Re: Rafting Penjing

Post  Russell Coker on Fri Dec 02, 2011 1:14 pm

Robert Steven wrote:Love to see Russell..but do you think it's in the Premna family ?

Yes, Premna japonica, but I don't know much about it and I never saw any in Japan. A few months ago there was a shohin thread of tree posted from a Japan trip. Maybe Morten??? Anyway, there was an odd little "maple" bonsai that was actually P. japonica.

I'll bet the plant at my parents has already dropped its leaves for winter. Maybe there will be a few left on the ends of the branches because it's in a protected spot, but I won't be there until Christmas. I'll keep you posted.

Thanks again for the wonderful information.

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Re: Rafting Penjing

Post  Robert Steven on Fri Dec 02, 2011 1:18 pm

Maybe you want to read my short article here about Premna...

http://robert-steven.ofbonsai.org/articles/

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