Sea Grapes need Suggestions

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Sea Grapes need Suggestions

Post  iben on Sun Mar 06, 2011 1:17 am

Hi all, salam dari Surabaya, Indonesia.
cheers... I have Sea grapes tree from seed and already 5 years old, two days ago i try to re-potting. Give me advice and suggestions for styling please...
Thank you all for any suggestions and advice
Very Happy

iben
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Re: Sea Grapes need Suggestions

Post  iben on Wed Mar 09, 2011 6:32 am

hue hue hue...nobody help me.. Sad

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Re: Sea Grapes need Suggestions

Post  Guest on Wed Mar 09, 2011 7:22 am

Someone posted some pictures recently. I did a search but nothing came up. I think it was either Khaimraj or Jun, so hopefully they will help.

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Re: Sea Grapes need Suggestions

Post  ogie on Wed Mar 09, 2011 7:51 am

will baddeley wrote:Someone posted some pictures recently. I did a search but nothing came up. I think it was either Khaimraj or Jun, so hopefully they will help.

Will i think its Khaimraj And he also posted a similar plat in Budi's birthday greetings

Regards,
Alex

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Re: Sea Grapes need Suggestions

Post  Khaimraj Seepersad on Wed Mar 09, 2011 9:52 am

Guys,

I am afraid the only suggestion I could make here is to put the tree into the ground and grow for another 5 years. On our side it takes a while for the seagrape to put on a trunk. With the super large leaves, a fat trunk helps to create the illusion of a seagrape tree.
Khaimraj

tree


close-up


Mam'e ????



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Re: Sea Grapes need Suggestions

Post  jrodriguez on Wed Mar 09, 2011 12:11 pm

Iben,

Apa Kabar, Salam dari Porto Rico!!! (How are you, greeting from Puerto Rico)

Sea grapes, generally, are not the ideal bonsai subject. They are very difficult to ramify and the leaves are usually too big for small bonsai. Now that I told you their bad qualities, let me enumerate the good:

1) When in fruit, the trees look spectacular
2) Their spring bronze/reddish foliage is difficult to surpass
3)On old trees, the character of the trunk is very interesting.

Below, a collected specimen with well over 15 year of bonsai training. This is the only Sea Grape in my collection. I would suggest you to plant the tree in the ground and prune it regularly. When in fertile soil, sea grapes tend to grow really fast and the new branches fatten up to the point that bending them is a real problem. Because of this, directional pruning is your best option when developing a trunk line. Once the trunk is established and the tree is trasferred to a pot, you can begin to shape the secondary and tertiary growth by combining grow and cut tecniques with wire positioning.


Last edited by jrodriguez on Wed Mar 09, 2011 12:26 pm; edited 1 time in total

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Re: Sea Grapes need Suggestions

Post  jrodriguez on Wed Mar 09, 2011 12:12 pm


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Re: Sea Grapes need Suggestions

Post  jrodriguez on Wed Mar 09, 2011 12:13 pm


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Post  jrodriguez on Wed Mar 09, 2011 12:14 pm


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Post  jrodriguez on Wed Mar 09, 2011 12:15 pm


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Re: Sea Grapes need Suggestions

Post  Khaimraj Seepersad on Wed Mar 09, 2011 12:45 pm

Jose,

really beautiful seagrape. A little tilt on the stone / seagrape and you have seagrape at the cliffs of Toco on my side. Maybe a pot with a water / land separation, to suggest hanging over the ocean.
Top marks !!
Khaimraj

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Re: Sea Grapes need Suggestions

Post  Guest on Wed Mar 09, 2011 1:04 pm

Sea grape guys (Khaimraj and Jose Luis),

does sea grapes needs occasional salt water/seawater like Phempis acidula? I'm planning to look for seagrape material,,,we got lots of sea grapes all over the country.

regards,
jun Smile

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Re: Sea Grapes need Suggestions

Post  jrodriguez on Wed Mar 09, 2011 2:18 pm

Jun,

Do Sea Grapes need sea water? Yes and no. It al depends on the tree. Usually, trees that have been harvested from the sea shore do better with ocassional sea water. Scale type pests are dettered from attacking trees which are sprayed with salt water. Also, fruit production is better when sea salt is involved. The fruit tastes better when ripe.

When sea water is added, the leaf lamina is thicker and smaller. If properly cultivated, you can redice the leaves to the size of a US half dollar or even a quarter.

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Re: Sea Grapes need Suggestions

Post  Khaimraj Seepersad on Wed Mar 09, 2011 3:03 pm

Jun,

most sea side trees that we have are really growing in solid clay, the sand part is often less than 6 inches [ 15 cm ]. So my buttonwoods, sea grapes, randias and other high tide trees handle seablast with very ugly thick leaves [ as Jose said ] but grow inland with normal water.

Without the sea spray, the leaves are finer and way more attractive. Seagrape berries are hot to the taste and as far as I am concerned an acquired taste [ maybe as a child Laughing .]

I have a 25 foot youngester seagrape growing on the front lawn, always with berries, which the birds love.

Fertilize heavily before defoliation and place in the hottest sun you can give for maximum dwarfing of the leaves. Trying for American dime size.

Wood is eaten on our side by termites, maturity of the tree makes no difference, nor does the dry season seablast.

I have found that open placement and heavy sun removes most insects and of course I use organic [ compost / cocopeat ] stuff in my mix. I haven't used any insecticide save a systemic for the Clerodendrum that comes from Barbados. We have a bug that just loves the leaves.

In this case if you can legally, I - encourage - to get a big, shapely trunk, but try to avoid the deadwood if you can.
Stay Well.
Khaimraj

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Re: Sea Grapes need Suggestions

Post  Guest on Wed Mar 09, 2011 3:19 pm

Jose Luis and Khaimraj,

Thank you guys! I appreciate it.

I'll start my search and follow your advice...I'll try to start with small ones first and see if I can keep it alive.

regards,
jun Smile


Last edited by jun on Wed Mar 09, 2011 3:27 pm; edited 1 time in total

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Re: Sea Grapes need Suggestions

Post  Guest on Wed Mar 09, 2011 3:24 pm

Iben,

my apology if I'm hitching on your thread. but thanks to you too.
...btw, try to experiment first on your little tree, try to learn first its behavior and growth pattern before you acquire a bigger tree.


regards,
jun Smile


Last edited by jun on Wed Mar 09, 2011 3:50 pm; edited 1 time in total

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Re: Sea Grapes need Suggestions

Post  fiona on Wed Mar 09, 2011 3:34 pm

What is the botanical name for this tree please?

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Re: Sea Grapes need Suggestions

Post  jrodriguez on Wed Mar 09, 2011 3:45 pm

Jun,

No!!!! Start big....if you can. Remember the leaf size.

Fiona:

Cocoloba uvifera

Kind Regards,

Jose Luis

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Re: Sea Grapes need Suggestions

Post  Guest on Wed Mar 09, 2011 3:53 pm

jrodriguez wrote:Jun,

No!!!! Start big....if you can. Remember the leaf size.

Fiona:

Cocoloba uvifera

Kind Regards,

Jose Luis


Oh yeah yeah! right, the leaf size. I was looking at your very nice ramified tree, and forgot the leaves. Thanks.

regards,
jun Smile scratch

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Re: Sea Grapes need Suggestions

Post  Khaimraj Seepersad on Wed Mar 09, 2011 6:44 pm

Wow, Jun,

starting with a small tree -help, help the sky is falling !!

Always keep your eye out for a seedling that has more branches than average. It will probably be weaker than the others, as seagrapes tend to live in communities, suffocating out who ever cannot extend rapidly. The ones that can multi-branch would be the best for bonsai, but the first to die in a seagrape patch.

They make great mam'e, and the leaves will shrink to smaller than an American quarter, sometimes you get dime and smaller sizes. Remember I once had a 3 inch [ 7.5 cm ] tall specimen with 17 branches, and it just disappeared - too doo, doo doo, too doo, doo doo [ Twighlight Zone ]

And it is time to go an search for another - Yahooooooo !!!
Catch you later, Alligator.
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Re: Sea Grapes need Suggestions

Post  Guest on Wed Mar 09, 2011 9:46 pm

....remember one of my older posts here? I got one of the smallest bonsai around here. hehehe.
I will keep the small sea grape for experiment....then I will intentionally kill it when I'm done with it. (no environmentalist here, this is for Khaimraj eyes only).

regards,
jun Twisted Evil

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Re: Sea Grapes need Suggestions

Post  Khaimraj Seepersad on Wed Mar 09, 2011 10:16 pm

Ok topic heading East, literally - ha ha ha.
Have fun Jun. Laughing
Laughingly.
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Re: Sea Grapes need Suggestions

Post  iben on Thu Mar 10, 2011 2:12 am

Will,Ogie,Khaimraj, Jose Luis, Jun, Fiona....Salam dari Surabaya- Indonesia..
Thank you for your kind and complete information you have been giving to me about Sea grapes.
I am very interesting about that because this type unique and seldom in Surabaya-Indonesia. I have been looked for at every nursery but can not find that tree.
I ever got that from my friend 5 years ago, and i will do instruction from Jose & Khaimraj...I will plant in the ground and hope that 10 years later become the only one sea grapes bonsai tree in Surabaya- Indonesia..hahaha...
I love this forum... thumbs up

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