twisted trunk on pines

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twisted trunk on pines

Post  Hombre on Mon Jan 10, 2011 4:51 pm

Could someone tell me if you have tried the technique that use the Japanese on pines winding wire on the trunk and leaving it there in order the trunk get twisted form?
And if yes, what is the right period and on how old tress?

Thanks in advance .
Best regards Lazaros

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Re: twisted trunk on pines

Post  EdMerc on Mon Jan 10, 2011 5:41 pm

What you describe would not twist the trunk. It would cause it to bulge, eventually rolling over and embedding the wire withing itself. It's shape would still be that which it was before, except that you would now have ugly scars to deal with for many, many years before they faded enough to be overlooked. However, they never go completely away.

It's true that some Japanese growers use this technique, but it's to induce fast growth. Not for twisting.

Ed

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twisted trunk on pines

Post  Guest on Mon Jan 10, 2011 5:45 pm

Hello Lazaros. For quickest results, wire should be applied to Pines in the ground or large training boxes. Two or three large wires applied so they are next to each other to gain a wide shari and not in a parallel helix. Parallel Helix will look unnatural, so vary it. Leave the wire on so that a callous forms on the sides of the wire, almost to the point that the wire starts to be covered. Remove the wire and the tissue undeneath should be dead or at least extremely weak. Remove the tissue underneath and seal the sides with cut paste as a precaution.

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Re: twisted trunk on pines

Post  EdMerc on Mon Jan 10, 2011 6:32 pm

That's interesting Will. And a twisting shari can be created this way? I never heard of it before. Thanks for sharing.

In that case, Lazaros, disregard my post about it not working. I guess it would if not left on too long. Makes sense.

Thanks,
Ed

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Re: twisted trunk on pines

Post  Guest on Mon Jan 10, 2011 6:37 pm

Hello Ed. I have seen this same technique used to create deadwood helix on Junipers as well. Making them look convicing is the difficult bit.

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Re: twisted trunk on pines

Post  JimLewis on Mon Jan 10, 2011 7:26 pm

I would think that a major problem in making the resulting shari look real is to NOT wire evenly like we try to do when bending branches (wire evenly spaced all the way up the trunk) but to have the wire have different size gaps between revolutions.

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Jim Lewis - lewisjk@windstream.net - Western NC - People, when Columbus discovered this country, it was plumb full of nuts and berries. And I'm right here to tell you the berries are just about all gone. Uncle Dave Macon, old-time country musician

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Twisted Trunk on Pines

Post  bonsaisr on Mon Jan 10, 2011 10:00 pm

I have a shohin JBP that I bought a couple of years ago. They did this wire thing on it. Of course by now the wire has long disappeared and the trunk is sort of gnarly. Only problem is that now there is some inverse taper near the bottom. I wish they hadn't done it.
Iris

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Re: twisted trunk on pines

Post  Hombre on Mon Jan 10, 2011 10:41 pm

First of all a great thanks to all of you , Ed , Will , Jim and of course bonsaisr.
Will for me, the pine is a relatively new species, so I bought 8 black pine trees other smaller and other bigger in order to do my first steps.
As in any decent Bonsai, the most important is the trunk, so seeing the techniques that I mentioned in my question I thought I could apply it to one of the newer trees.
I decided it would be easier to do on a tree with several newer more flexible trunk yet in some it was more rapid growth but also would close the wounds more quickly.
So my thinking is as follows, first wired the trunk in order to give him movement, and the next year to implement the wires parallel to each other and again at 45-degree angle, but how can i do that if i don't make a helix?


Thanks again Lazaros
some pictures of the trees






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Re: twisted trunk on pines

Post  Hombre on Mon Jan 10, 2011 10:51 pm

Take a look.
http://bonsaifarm.tv/wob-series-2/wob2-5/



Best regards
Lazaros

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Re: twisted trunk on pines

Post  Guest on Mon Jan 10, 2011 11:08 pm

JimLewis wrote:I would think that a major problem in making the resulting shari look real is to NOT wire evenly like we try to do when bending branches (wire evenly spaced all the way up the trunk) but to have the wire have different size gaps between revolutions.

Yes Jim. If you read my original post, I may have said this.

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Re: twisted trunk on pines

Post  my nellie on Mon Jan 10, 2011 11:34 pm

Hombre wrote:Take a look.
http://bonsaifarm.tv/wob-series-2/wob2-5/
Best regards
Lazaros
Lazaros,then you should be prepared to "live" with those ugly scars, waiting for a loooong time until they simply disguise themselves..., because they will never disappear.
Would you really like the unnatural outcome, I wonder!

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Re: twisted trunk on pines

Post  Guest on Tue Jan 11, 2011 12:04 am

The wire removed in this video ( 6min 30 sec) was over the bark and not under as suggested.

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Re: twisted trunk on pines

Post  JimLewis on Tue Jan 11, 2011 2:00 pm

Yes Jim. If you read my original post, I may have said this.


Missed it. SO sorry.

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Jim Lewis - lewisjk@windstream.net - Western NC - People, when Columbus discovered this country, it was plumb full of nuts and berries. And I'm right here to tell you the berries are just about all gone. Uncle Dave Macon, old-time country musician

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Re: twisted trunk on pines

Post  Guest on Tue Jan 11, 2011 4:32 pm

That sounds really sarcastic Jim, but no probs. Very Happy

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Re: twisted trunk on pines

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