Mini-Pine and Mountain Ash

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Mini-Pine and Mountain Ash

Post  Copopit on Sat Nov 06, 2010 3:37 pm

The Pine: Can i just let it grow in this little pot and make it a really small bonsai or should i repot it to something bigger? Can this grow inside or do it have to grow outside? It really dosent matter to me though

This image is more to show how big the pot and tree is






Mountain Ash: Its just picture of the berries just to show what it looks like, the pot is also about the same size as the pine, can this also be a small bonsai? Can this also grow inside? I do live quite south in Norway wich in summer the temprature is higher outside than it is inside now if that does matter at all





I recently have gotten really exited about bonsai, and I think it might be my new hobby from now on Smile

The pine grew in a old grill wich had coal still in it, should i take some coal and mabye grind it up and mix it with the dirt? (same goes with the Salix i posted earlier this week: http://ibonsaiclub.forumotion.com/bonsai-questions-f7/salix-caprea-t4652.htm)

Thanks,
-Copo


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Re: Mini-Pine and Mountain Ash

Post  Storm on Sat Nov 06, 2010 3:50 pm

Dont know much about Mountain Ash, but the pine has to go outside. It needs a dormant period, and the warmth inside would kill it.
I have a few needle trees, and I just let them snow down. The snow also pack around, so the trees dont get so much beating while its at the coldest.

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Pine and Mountain Ash

Post  bonsaisr on Sat Nov 06, 2010 7:00 pm

I'm afraid you will need to grow that pine in the ground for five to ten years before you can even think about making a bonsai out of it. Don't even think about putting it in a pot. You don't need the charcoal, but you do need some of the soil it was growing in.
Iris

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Pine and Mountain Ash

Post  bonsaisr on Sat Nov 06, 2010 7:04 pm

Mountain ash can be used for bonsai. You understand growing from seed will take years. Go here: http://www.bonsai4me.com/SpeciesGuide/Sorbus.html
Iris

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Re: Mini-Pine and Mountain Ash

Post  Copopit on Sat Nov 06, 2010 7:36 pm

bonsaisr wrote:I'm afraid you will need to grow that pine in the ground for five to ten years before you can even think about making a bonsai out of it. Don't even think about putting it in a pot. You don't need the charcoal, but you do need some of the soil it was growing in.
Iris

Oh I dident know that Neutral But why do it need to grow in the ground for so long befor it can be placed in a pot? And does this go for all pine trees? So what I can do is to go in a nearby forest and look for a older more mature tree and place it is a verry big pot? Smile

And i though the mountain ash was a fast growing tree, guess ill just stick with my willow and my ficus then

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Pine and Mountain Ash

Post  bonsaisr on Sat Nov 06, 2010 8:00 pm

Copopit wrote:But why do it need to grow in the ground for so long befor it can be placed in a pot? And does this go for all pine trees? So what I can do is to go in a nearby forest and look for a older more mature tree and place it is a verry big pot? Smile

And i though the mountain ash was a fast growing tree, guess ill just stick with my willow and my ficus then
Pines grow very slowly, especially in a northern climate. Actually, that is what makes them so successful at survival. Yes, this is true for all pine species that are useful for bonsai. The trouble with looking for a mature specimen to dig up is that it takes a great deal of skill & experience. Join the nearest bonsai club & be on the lookout for someone who can teach you about collecting. Read the articles here about yamadori.
Yes, mountain ash is relatively fast growing. But growing from seed will take years before it is ready to be trained as a bonsai.
Iris

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Re: Mini-Pine and Mountain Ash

Post  Copopit on Sat Nov 06, 2010 8:08 pm

Thanks for the responses, your posts makes me a little wiser every time Very Happy

The only problem living where i live is that there are either none or very small bonsai communities here that i don't know of.

Just a quick question, is maples and oaks good beginner bonsais?

Thanks,
-Copo

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Mini Pine and Mountain Ash

Post  bonsaisr on Sat Nov 06, 2010 9:27 pm

I am not familiar with all the oaks & maples in your area. Field maple, Acer campestre, is recommended. Stay away from Norway maple, Acer platanoides, although some people have had success with it. Quercus robur, the common oak, is widely used for bonsai. You should also try larch. These are all easier than pines, but you should still expect to kill a few while you are learning.
I suggest you practice on some garden center trees, like Juniper.
Iris

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Re: Mini-Pine and Mountain Ash

Post  Copopit on Sat Nov 06, 2010 9:46 pm

Thanks for your input, reading about that beginners is pretty much goign to kill a few plants at first almost makes me feel bad for my ficus

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Re: Mini-Pine and Mountain Ash

Post  Guest on Sun Nov 07, 2010 11:29 am

Dont be too sad for your fig, we have all lost some trees along our journey with bonsai (or been miraculously lucky).

Having said that many of us still have something from our earliest time. My own is a Jacaranda that I dug as a seedling in the first few weeks of my obsession, that was 24 yrs ago. All the other trees I had at that time are long dead & rotted away to compost, the Jacaranda is still with me. It finally went from a mid sized pot into the ground to really grow & it hasnt looked back. I will dig it this week to root prune & replant on a new angle to accomodate the new design & future I would like for it, hopefully in another 20yrs it will truly be ready for a bonsai pot.

If you want to grow the pine in a pot instead of ground growing that is entirely possible & in some ways can be easier than trying to retrain the roots to fit a pot after it comes out of the ground. If you can track down some of the Bonsai Focus/ Bonsai Today magazines there have been several great articles on growing Japanese black pine to showable mame & shohin trees in around 10yrs (sorry I am not sure of the issue's but hopefully someone else here can fill in that gap). I dont know how they compare with your own pine but is worth looking into if you would really like this as a small tree.

Good luck with your new found hobby, it can very quickly consume & take over ThumbsUp

Matt

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Re: Mini-Pine and Mountain Ash

Post  Copopit on Sun Nov 07, 2010 12:18 pm

Thanks! I will see if i can find some magazines or mabye some articles on the web about the pine and the ficus, I have some more hope for my ficus now though since i have gotten some tips around the forum and reading stories and articles about them Smile


Do all junipers suit as bonsai? as in Norway we have LOTS of Juniperus communis.

Thanks,
-Copo

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Re: Mini-Pine and Mountain Ash

Post  Copopit on Sun Nov 07, 2010 3:59 pm

I went in to the woods not too long ago looking for a nice looking juniper but the ones i found had grown verry long roots going in one direction almost thick as the bush it self

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Mini Pine and Mountain Ash

Post  bonsaisr on Tue Nov 09, 2010 11:39 pm

See if you can get Bonsai from the Wild, by Nick Lenz.
Yes, J. communis and other native junipers are excellent for bonsai. You have to dig them up with as much of the roots as you can, and grow them in the ground for a few years while gradually shortening the roots.
Iris

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Re: Mini-Pine and Mountain Ash

Post  Copopit on Wed Nov 10, 2010 2:32 pm

By gradually shortening the roots you mean by take it out of the ground and trim them?

For now that sound like alot of work with the juniper, but ill keep searching for some junipers wich doesnt have too long roots Smile

And while we are at it, I found another pine, but this one is very old and have been growing in about 6 inch deep dirt for manny years and have about 3 inch thick trunk and a nice bowl shape at the top, and its about 40 cm high. Here are some pictures: (Sorry for bad image quality, im not very good at taking photos)





Is this possible to pot this? I do know for a fact that this tree is older than 5 years mabye 6 or 7.
It may not look much in the pictures but in real life it is very nice looking.



And I also found a breathtaking pine in a local hill, I do have pictures, also a video clip of it.


Thanks,
-Copo

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Re: Mini-Pine and Mountain Ash

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