The problem with Southern Chinese Elms in the Tropics

View previous topic View next topic Go down

The problem with Southern Chinese Elms in the Tropics

Post  Khaimraj Seepersad on Thu Oct 21, 2010 5:16 am

Hello to All,
[ specially for Alexandra and Sue ]

this is the problem with fast growing trees - happens to elms and fukien teas.

A life history - Chinese Southern Elm - height was 33cm [ 13 inches ]- 1994 now 30 cm [12 inches ] 2010.

Bought as a stick in 94 out of London, import from China. Mother of all my elms.
Never really meant to be a bonsai, but stock plant for the roots. Elm roots when cut and replanted will resprout easily.

The reddish pale image is 1996.

Never had any problems with this elm. Note how it starts off and how it ends.
By 2011, I start again.

Feel free to ask and comment
Khaimraj



2010 to start over - branches too thick.




Khaimraj Seepersad
Member


Back to top Go down

Re: The problem with Southern Chinese Elms in the Tropics

Post  Guest on Thu Oct 21, 2010 3:44 pm

Khaimraj,

why do you have to re start the design all over again? the tree I think is going on the same direction again.

regards,
jun Smile

Guest
Guest


Back to top Go down

Re: The problem with Southern Chinese Elms in the Tropics

Post  Khaimraj Seepersad on Thu Oct 21, 2010 9:36 pm

Jun,

when I repot on Jan.2 2011, I will re-assess and in two months later on I'll know. I try to make sure anything I am growing keeps some standard of smooth transition from branch into branchlet. Normally, I get an elm to be so dense at under 15 inches [ 38 cm ] that you cannot see through it. It's a standard I got from an image in, Classic Bonsai of Japan, image 159 - Japanese Zelkova - Broom 9inches [ 22 cm ].

I have do a good deal of thinning out to shoot an image with certain trees. Otherwise it looks like a hedge.

If I am not breaking any rules of the IBC gallery I will post it later. Just got home.
Until.
Khaimraj

Khaimraj Seepersad
Member


Back to top Go down

Re: The problem with Southern Chinese Elms in the Tropics

Post  Khaimraj Seepersad on Thu Oct 21, 2010 10:23 pm

IBC moderators,

If I am breaking any rules please say so.

Jun,

when I got into bonsai, I had exposure to both Chinese and Japanese styles of trees, plus my preference in Fine Art is Idealism/Naturalism, the Idealism is stronger hence the Da Vinci/ Raphael over Tiziano/ Correggio preferences. But I still like all 4 Old Masters.

With trees, I prefer to go around and look at trees as mature specimens. Which I did in the US and Europe, and at home in the Caribbean. From the Chinese, I took the clip and grow technique, the Japanese, the rules of volume [ more the principles behind the rules of volume ] and the mature tree look from home.

This is why I love Buttonwood [ Conocarpus Erectus ] as a tree here in Trinidad, is heavily domed and full of leaves, a very healthy tree, with a bark that moves so much it looks alive/mobile.
But not the driftwood laden specimens you see so frequently.

I also prefer to work at 15 inches [ 38cm ] and down to 1 inch [ 2.5 cm ], because I like high maintainence trees and as I get older larger trees would be to much to re-pot or move.

In the early days, the trees I had access to were, very low on branches / branchlets and it mattered not how thick the trunk, it was sparse city with branches. No matter how much you explained, these trees would never impress anyone as bonsai / penjing.

Hence my search for high branch density trees - Celtis, Ulmus, Illex and so on. Years later I can also work with Tamarinds, Gmelina, Carmona[ Eh...] and I have grown attached to Sageretia. I still collect the occasional seedling of local species, but at least I have what I set out to do.
This is also why I have problems with Ficus, Psidium, Bougainvillea and others popular on this island.

Anyhow this is long so here's the promised image.

Zelkova - Broom - 9 inches [ 22 cm ] Yes, it is over dense, but it can always be thinned out. Better to be over dense, than never able to be dense.






Khaimraj Seepersad
Member


Back to top Go down

Re: The problem with Southern Chinese Elms in the Tropics

Post  Todd Ellis on Fri Oct 22, 2010 3:05 am

Hi Khaimraj,
Which branches on your elm did you think were too thick? I thought by your description (before I saw your last picture) that your were going to cut the main branches to start over. It appears that you cut off the finer twigs.

I like your Zelkova very much!

Keep on growing!!!
Salut, Todd

Todd Ellis
Member


Back to top Go down

Re: The problem with Southern Chinese Elms in the Tropics

Post  Khaimraj Seepersad on Fri Oct 22, 2010 11:24 am

Morning Todd,

apologies for the late reply. I was a bit tired last night.

Well, firstly, I believe you missed the bit where I stated that the image of the Zelkova was from - Classic Bonsai of Japan.

Secondly, what you are looking at is me, cutting out all the fine branches that had become too thick and disproportionate with time. This tree has been grown by me, since 1994, and the last image is sometime last month 2010. The slimmer pot probably came into use around 1997 -1998.

It was sold to me as 15 or so years old, out of London. The first image is what it looked like when I pruned it to start shaping.

As of last year, the tree was not repotted and the removal of over thick branches began. Next year, i may decide to fatten the trunk to three inches and just start over completely.
The idea behind this topic, was to show others working with Southern Elms, how a design is outgrown,
to expect it and do something positive about it. The impermanence of the craft.
Khaimraj


Khaimraj Seepersad
Member


Back to top Go down

Re: The problem with Southern Chinese Elms in the Tropics

Post  Todd Ellis on Fri Oct 22, 2010 1:30 pm

Thanks, I understand what your were saying. I would like to see a picture of your Zelkova when it drops its leaves.
Best, Todd

Todd Ellis
Member


Back to top Go down

southern elm trees

Post  moyogijohn on Fri Oct 22, 2010 1:39 pm

Khamraj,,The zelcova is a very nice tree!! I LIKE IT VERY MUCH...The elm looks really good to me the way it is..you know much better how it will branch out for you though..here if you get limbs like that you leave them alone!! it takes much longer to get a thee like that..wish mine would look like it..good work take care..john

moyogijohn
Member


Back to top Go down

Re: The problem with Southern Chinese Elms in the Tropics

Post  Khaimraj Seepersad on Fri Oct 22, 2010 2:07 pm

Not my zelkova - from BOOK - Classic Bonsai of Japan
Not my zelkova - from BOOK - Classic Bonsai of Japan
Not my zelkova - from BOOK - Classic Bonsai of Japan
Not my zelkova - from BOOK - Classic Bonsai of Japan
Not my zelkova - from BOOK - Classic Bonsai of Japan
Not my zelkova - from BOOK - Classic Bonsai of Japan
Not my zelkova - from BOOK - Classic Bonsai of Japan
Not my zelkova - from BOOK - Classic Bonsai of Japan
Not my zelkova - from BOOK - Classic Bonsai of Japan

Khaimraj -------- now out of breath Laughing

Thank you Todd and John.

Khaimraj Seepersad
Member


Back to top Go down

Re: The problem with Southern Chinese Elms in the Tropics

Post  Jesse on Fri Oct 22, 2010 3:33 pm

Wow, you have a great looking zelkova there. I too want to see it without leaves. Do you ever bring it to the states for bonsai shows? How long have you had it in training?































Just messing with you!

Not my zelkova - from BOOK - Classic Bonsai of Japan
Not my zelkova - from BOOK - Classic Bonsai of Japan
Not my zelkova - from BOOK - Classic Bonsai of Japan
Not my zelkova - from BOOK - Classic Bonsai of Japan
Not my zelkova - from BOOK - Classic Bonsai of Japan
Not my zelkova - from BOOK - Classic Bonsai of Japan
Not my zelkova - from BOOK - Classic Bonsai of Japan
Not my zelkova - from BOOK - Classic Bonsai of Japan
Not my zelkova - from BOOK - Classic Bonsai of Japan

Khaimraj -------- now out of breath Laughing

I literally laughed out loud when I read that.

Jesse
Member


Back to top Go down

Re: The problem with Southern Chinese Elms in the Tropics

Post  Khaimraj Seepersad on Fri Oct 22, 2010 4:07 pm

Laughing Laughing Laughing Laughing Laughing Laughing Laughing Laughing Laughing
Jesse,

you are so lucky, I was going to repeat it again, down the paaaaaaaaaaaggggggggeeeeeeeeeee.
Hee hee.
Khaimraj

Khaimraj Seepersad
Member


Back to top Go down

Re: The problem with Southern Chinese Elms in the Tropics

Post  Hawaiian77 on Fri Oct 22, 2010 4:51 pm

Howzit Khaimraj,

Your funny......Mahalo for the laugh. "Your da man!! ThumbsUp

A Hui Hou,
-Tim Cool

Hawaiian77
Member


Back to top Go down

Re: The problem with Southern Chinese Elms in the Tropics

Post  Sponsored content Today at 12:23 am


Sponsored content


Back to top Go down

View previous topic View next topic Back to top


 
Permissions in this forum:
You cannot reply to topics in this forum