My trident maple

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My trident maple

Post  Seth Ellwood on Thu Dec 10, 2009 9:47 pm

This is my trident maple. I aquired it in jan of this year. It had been collected 1 year prior and in this pot.

and at the time this was my projected front however I wanted to see her naked to get a real idea of what the new front would be b4 doing anything drastic.So that bring us up to today. This past w/e she was 98%defoliated and I decided to repot in to a training pot .And now I see a few better fronts due to nebari uncovering and a slight change in planting angle so I would like some opinions as to what others see as the front of the tree virts welcome.This was the old projected front but the nebari seems a little lop sided

here is another side of the tree.I like this side all except the obvious pruning scars that would be an eye sore for some time and the nebari is still unbalanced.

here is another opiton it shows a better nebari but you would still see the pruning scars untill they healed over witch would be at least the next 5 to 7 years.

Next up is a side I like it has a good nebari and great taper but still shows the pruning scars and like all the sides I will still need to remove several branches to get the final design.

And last but not least this side shows a good nebari taper is not as good but no scars untill I chop the upper branch on the right .

I must apologize up front for not using a plain background I had to take these pics solo.OOh and I uncovered about 4more inches of trunk past this pic to get to the nebari cheers

Seth Ellwood
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Re: My trident maple

Post  JimLewis on Thu Dec 10, 2009 10:07 pm

Very nice base and nice taper. Those first few branches, though, are huge. If this were mine, they'd all go.

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Jim Lewis - lewisjk@windstream.net - Western NC - People, when Columbus discovered this country, it was plumb full of nuts and berries. And I'm right here to tell you the berries are just about all gone. Uncle Dave Macon, old-time country musician

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Re: My trident maple

Post  Carolee on Fri Dec 11, 2009 12:38 am

You have trees that are such a big size! How have you obtained them? Have you been growing them for some time?

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Re: My trident maple

Post  Seth Ellwood on Fri Dec 11, 2009 2:19 am

Jim I agree to some extent however I plan to reduce the height of this tree by half or 1/3 and a few of the lower branches will be removed but some will be retained I would take many years to regrow new branches to this size and caliber.
Carolee,I have been very blessed to have the gift to gab and negotiate.I also have some very great friends in the bonsai community and have helped me in toughtimes and vise versa.All of my trees except the trident have been aquired through scouring the urban landscape and local nurseries.

Seth Ellwood
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Re: My trident maple

Post  JimLewis on Fri Dec 11, 2009 12:59 pm

I would take many years to regrow new branches to this size and caliber.

Very true, but don't you think they're, proportionately, too big for the tree -- especially if it is cut down?

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Jim Lewis - lewisjk@windstream.net - Western NC - People, when Columbus discovered this country, it was plumb full of nuts and berries. And I'm right here to tell you the berries are just about all gone. Uncle Dave Macon, old-time country musician

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Re: My trident maple

Post  djlen on Fri Dec 11, 2009 3:40 pm

That is a beautiful tree and I'm sooooooo jealous!!!! Shocked
The nurseries in our area seldom carry anything like that and for that
matter trying to find a Trident Maple, Zelkova or Chinese Elm is almost
an impossibilty.
Thanks for sharing the pictures. Good luck with your tree.

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Re: My trident maple

Post  Seth Ellwood on Fri Dec 11, 2009 10:36 pm

Thanks. This tree was not a nursery stock plant it was planted in the groung as a seedling several years ago then dug up 2 years ago.

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Re: My trident maple

Post  NeilDellinger on Sat Dec 12, 2009 11:23 am

Just wondering where you plan on chopping the tree. If the tree was dug 2 years ago and its been in a large nursery container all that time the tree should have enough energy to grow new proportionate branches very very quickly (3 years), this includes secondary branches.

You should be able to create a nice tree with very good taper with this stump fairly quickly.

Nice work finding a good trident stump. They are huge fun.

Neil

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Re: My trident maple

Post  Seth Ellwood on Sat Dec 12, 2009 5:04 pm

Jim I do think the majority of the large branches are dis proportionate to the tree after it is cut but I will keep a few of the smaller ones to utilize as primary branches and re grow the upper branches .You can see in a few pics where I marked the ones I will be removing with white correction fluid.

Neil I had to do some serious cutting of the rootage on this tree but I know it could handle it The mess that was made in the ground was never corrected and I figured now was the time to do so I was still able to leave 25% of the root mass but the cuts were pretty drastic the roots grew down 6" from the bassal flare and fused with each other under the base of the tree creating a mess of tangled fused mayhem so I had to saw it off back to the natural flare .Luckly for me I just had to remove roots that were tangeled and fused that were 2" in diameter and not chop the whole bottom of the tree off. I think I might let the tree recover for 1 growing season b4 performing the chop. Any suggestions on the front and the chop and virts welcome.

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Re: My trident maple

Post  NeilDellinger on Sat Dec 12, 2009 8:14 pm

Seth,
Yes, if the roots have been cut back hard let it grow for a season. That said I would take at least some of the top off. I've experienced a few slow starts in the spring with tridents if I did not cut back some branching after a particularly hard root prune. Nothing terrible, just took the tree a little while to get moving. Too few roots, too many buds/leaves emerging.

I don't do virtuals but...if it were mine I would go just a few inches shy of where the taper stops. (just below the first branch).
Do a hard prune but don't chop this June, then go ahead and pick where you want branching and use this recover season to thread/approach graft some seedlings. Perfect solution..fast forward your progress maybe 2-3 seasons. I am a fan of airlayering so, I would be picking out a few decent caliper branches to use as future shohin material.

Nice tree....have fun! Very Happy

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Re: My trident maple

Post  Seth Ellwood on Sun Dec 13, 2009 3:36 am

Good idea neil I will have to look for a really long drill bit to thread graft with. The tree is approx 4-5" at the inter section of those first branches. I don't think any of the top prtion of the tree is good for airlayering due to it splits up above where I plan to chop and It has some large scaring up in that area from the initial chop it recived .I will try to get some better pics up tomorrow with a plain back ground .As for shohin I've got another one up my sleeve Twisted Evil

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Re: My trident maple

Post  NeilDellinger on Sun Dec 13, 2009 4:05 am

Seth,
No need for a super long drill bit, you dont have to drill through at the widest point. Aproach grafting is just as effective but easier to mess up if you don't get the cambiums lined up right. Thread grafting is also easier to keep stable while the graft takes.



Come one now...share what you've got "up your sleeve".

Neil

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Re: My trident maple

Post  Seth Ellwood on Sun Dec 13, 2009 3:25 pm

Here is what's up my sleeve. My little shohin or should I say soon to be shohin I will be chopping 2/3 of this tree off this year and doing a repot in to a larger training pot.



I think this will be the new front and I will chop it at the 2 nd branch on the left as the new apex


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Re: My trident maple

Post  Seth Ellwood on Sun Dec 13, 2009 4:41 pm

here are a few shots of this tree with a little better background.




I think pic 2 or pic 4 for the front and if pic 2 chop right above the smallest branch utlize that as new apex. Or if pic 4 chop in a pointed shape to create some more taper and thread graft a branch just below the eye poker branch right where the wire comes to a point below the front branch to become the new apex.Opinions??

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Re: My trident maple

Post  Seth Ellwood on Wed Apr 21, 2010 4:07 am

I did a pretty drastic prune on the roots of this tree b4 putting it in this growing tub and decided to not prune any branches. It has proven once again how resilient this species is it is in full leaf and doing great.I was wanting to know when the best time to start thinking about thread grafting would be for this tree if anyone has some insight I would appreciate the info.




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Re: My trident maple

Post  Seth Ellwood on Tue Aug 17, 2010 7:25 pm

Aftet some negotiations and money exchanging I now have this trident . I still have access to the other one and will probibly get it back aswell but for now This is my new one. I have marked where I plan on going with this tree and after leaf drop I will look again to be sure.



The reverse taper at the top where I bent the new apex over will be carved and healed .What does everyone think of the #2 branch on the right ?? I think it is a little too big and planned on grafting a whip to replace it next spring.

2 of the left and 1right side



And the rear where you can see the large cut that was made to create the taper of this tree it is completly healed over but will always remain as the rear of the tree

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Re: My trident maple

Post  Seth Ellwood on Tue Aug 17, 2010 7:39 pm

I lost the sohin in the deal aswell but retained another one for potential shohin/medium size the white line is where I will be chopping in spring to try to heal over and create taper. This tree was chopped back some years ago and not taken proper care of and you will see the result.At the white line the taper stops and so does the slight movement of the tree.Iwill leave the lower branches on to thread graft in spring b4 removing.I like the nebari on this one.You can see in pic 3 just below the white cut line there is a dormant bud site hopefully I can get one to pop there.




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Re: My trident maple

Post  Guest on Tue Aug 17, 2010 9:25 pm

Hello again Seth. I would suggest reducing this tree now. Cut it where your mark is, reduce the bottom branches to stubbs and buds will pop everywhere. As they appear, re cut the trunk at a 45/60 degree angle for increased taper and pop it in the ground for fast callousing.

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Re: My trident maple

Post  Seth Ellwood on Tue Aug 17, 2010 9:35 pm

you don't think it is to late in the season??

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Re: My trident maple

Post  Guest on Tue Aug 17, 2010 9:41 pm

Fairly warm where you are isn't it? Any new growth will harden off before Winter.

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Re: My trident maple

Post  Seth Ellwood on Tue Aug 17, 2010 9:43 pm

it is still in the 90's . it dosen't start to get cold around here till the end of november. Mabye I was thinking of japanese maple that liked to die back if you cut them this time of year.

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Re: My trident maple

Post  Guest on Tue Aug 17, 2010 9:55 pm

'd say thats plenty of time. Plenty of feed too!

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Re: My trident maple

Post  Seth Ellwood on Sun Aug 21, 2011 4:40 pm

Lil update on these two. The larger one I tried to thread graft this late spring/earily summer without success so I will try again this spring . I posted a few youtube videos of the initial styling on this tree as well from previous pics to the thread grafting up to these pics.
][url][/url]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5HM_gRykfw0

[url=https://servimg.com/image_preview.php?i=256&u=14379618][/url

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Re: My trident maple

Post  Seth Ellwood on Sun Aug 21, 2011 4:51 pm

I decided to cut the smaller one down last year with mixed results it survived and sprouted out this spring .Made a decision without consulting me where it wanted the new apex to be and the rest died back.I was pretty satisfied with the result. I will have a lot of carving to do this spring on this little bugger.



You can see in this last pic where the tree decided to make it's own taper line that I will subordinately follow this spring.It did the same thing on the other side.

Over all in a few years this tree will make a great sumo .I might repot it in to one of the large growing tubs to help excelerate the healing of the back side of the tree after carving.

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Re: My trident maple

Post  Seth Ellwood on Wed Nov 09, 2011 1:47 am

A few videos on the progression of the large tree
PT : 1 http://www.youtube.com/user/ellwoodbonsai?feature=mhee#p/u/0/5HM_gRykfw0
PT: 2 http://www.youtube.com/user/ellwoodbonsai?feature=mhee#p/u/1/aTGp4aPU7X8
PT: 3 http://www.youtube.com/user/ellwoodbonsai?feature=mhee#p/u/2/sYo4JPLVx-Q
PT: 4 http://www.youtube.com/user/ellwoodbonsai?feature=mhee#p/u/3/rGCyvM8IRhU

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Re: My trident maple

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