please give me some idea for the two stones

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please give me some idea for the two stones

Post  riversoul on Sun Jul 06, 2014 10:17 am

I have got two stones, however I feel uncertain which way to display the stone is better because I will order to make daiza for them.  Please give me some idea if you have. thank you very much.

1-1#

front side


side


back side

1-2#

front


back

1-3#


2-1#

front


back

2-2#

front


back


riversoul
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Re: please give me some idea for the two stones

Post  Guest on Sun Jul 06, 2014 10:38 am

Hi Riversould

I like you topic very much, as it give food to a lot of thoughts.

Taking a fast look at your stones, do I prefer the the last photo of the first stone, it is quit powerfull I think...

the last stone could be viewed like this

A landskapestone wiht  some levels...

Is the carwer a very good carver?...we some times see extraordinary nice detailed carwings from China, this could add more fun to your question.

Kind regards Yvonne

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Re: please give me some idea for the two stones

Post  dick benbow on Sun Jul 06, 2014 2:21 pm

In Yvonne's example, where she turns the stone upside down, I'm going to have to agree. Nothing is more unsettling to me to see stones teetering unbalanced on a tiny daiza. Still, in certain parts of this world there are stones in nature that appear this way. tension if used correcty can be effective but not my preference.

Thank-you for sharing. I agree with all the fronts Smile

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Re: please give me some idea for the two stones

Post  riversoul on Sun Jul 06, 2014 2:50 pm

Many thank for Yvonne and dick benbow suggestion. I will show the two stone again with daiza in the future if possible.
I have many stones, but I don't know to do the good daiza for them, sometimes I also try to carve some daiza for my stones by myself, but most of them are unsatisfactory. I would like to post some of them to you in few days.

with regards.
riversoul

riversoul
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Re: please give me some idea for the two stones

Post  Chris Cochrane on Mon Jul 07, 2014 1:42 am

Hi Riversoul...  I cannot know how you are moved by your stones, but it is obvious you are engaged with their natural contours as viewing stones.  I also feel your recognition is emotional and appealingly ambiguous in representation.  These contribute to feeling in stone presentation.

In Japan, viewing stones (suiseki) are appreciated for evoking emotion, impression and/or atmosphere when displayed artistically.  Commonly, stones also represent landscape views (mountain, mountain range, waterfall, waterpool/lake, archways-in-water et al.) & objects close to remote nature (e.g, wild animals, built bridges, spiritually-elevated human figures et al.).  Some represent expression so abstractly that their representation is unclear.

In Chinese scholar rock collection, early enthusiasts chose stones representing landscapes or animal images suggestive of nature unmitigated by man. Many thought stones of animal shape also represented a remote landscape scene recalling an animal's form (e.g. "Dragon's Back Mountain Range Stone").  Literati with Daoist inspiration thought owning a desktop-sized stone of similar shape to a real or mythic landscape allowed them to metaphorically control the qi/"energy breath" of vast landscapes compressed into a carefully chosen stone. The Chinese literati were exceptionally open to abstract form.

I am not very well versed in modern shangshi stone expression, but it has allowances far broader than the classical Chinese & Japanese forms.  Korean viewing stones originally followed Chinese scholar rock form and more recently have adopted expression more closely related to suiseki.  It is easily possible to create a meaningful collection of stones without adhering to any classical form, but appreciation of classical practice will likely enrich your enjoyment.

Your first stone as first illustrated (#1-1, front side) struck me immediately as representing an animal form with possible landscape representation.  The lifting of one foot is masterful in animating the rock to suggest a legged creature.  Despite an immediately positive response to your first photo, my favorite views are "#1-2, front" & "#1-2, back."  The negative space defined by the archway & hanging protrusion under the stone creates a feeling of depth (particularly in view "#1-2, back") and weathered-aging in a coastal scene that is very moving.  I feel the wash of waves which cut the archway.

Arguably, your second stone is less apt in capturing an unexpected atmosphere.  For sheer representation, your choice of mounting it in the form of a spreading letter "Y" is possibly the best.  A floating mountain in the Eastern Sea (east of China) was said to be grounded on the back of a giant mythological turtle & to rise vertically until splitting in two directions.  The stone seat on which goddess Avalokiteshvara (Indian origin) sits in royal ease is also described as rising in similar form.

Hope this helps in your discovery of options for mounting.

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Re: please give me some idea for the two stones

Post  riversoul on Mon Jul 07, 2014 3:29 am

Hi, Chris Cochrane
Thank you very much for your information.
The second stone display like 2-2# due to it look like Lucid Ganoderma, Lucid Ganoderma is one of Mascot in the though of Chinese, also it is a precious medicine in China since thousands of year ago.



Lucid Ganoderma

I also have a mountain stone, one of my friend said that it is better to display look like an animal, but I think it is better to display it look like landscape and mountain shape suiseki.

it looke like an animal from this side


front side

back side
it is mountain shape landscape stone display in this way, I think it is better.

Thank again for suggestion from friends.

with regards
riversoul

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Re: please give me some idea for the two stones

Post  Chris Cochrane on Mon Jul 07, 2014 5:23 am

Hi Riversoul...  I like the fungus as you present it.  Lingzhi fungi are often pictured as natural companions to landscape stones.  

- Chinese Album Leaf (17th century) at Harvard Art Museum: click HERE  

- Chinese scroll (late 19th century at Boston Museum of Fine Arts: click HERE

- My collection includes a related Japanese scroll (late 19th century, subject: Standing Rock & Lingzhi) reputedly painted by Nomura Bunkyo, one of the teachers of the notable landscape painter (and also suiseki enthusiast) Yamamoto Shunkyo.  

I would prefer your long narrow stone (which looks to be a Ying rock) mounted vertically to represent a Daoist-inspired steep cliff stone-- also known as a "fabulous (landscape) rock/qishi.  I've one that could similarly be mounted horizontally, but I prefer imagining it as an overhanging steep cliff.

Steep cliff with overhanging peak...


Last edited by Chris Cochrane on Mon Jul 07, 2014 3:43 pm; edited 1 time in total (Reason for editing : corrected keying of proper name "Shunkyo")

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Re: please give me some idea for the two stones

Post  riversoul on Mon Jul 07, 2014 8:02 am

Hi,Chris Cochrane
The long narrow stone is Ba Yin mountain stone come from mountain near our city in Guangxi province. "Ba" mean 8 (eight), "Yin" mean sound or voice. You can hear some brisk sound from stone when you knock on the stone with a piece of metal or hard object, so the stone called Ba Yin stone. Some local people use this kind of stone to make stone piano like some Chinese ancient musical percussion instrument. The stone look like Ying rock and is similar to Lingbi stone.
I am glad to hear you know so much about chinese knowledge and I also would like to share my information with all of friends here.

with regards.

riversoul

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Re: please give me some idea for the two stones

Post  Chris Cochrane on Mon Jul 07, 2014 5:07 pm

Hi Riversoul... Your Ba Yin/"8-voices" stone is beautiful, & your generous description makes it even more engaging.  

Will you please share more information about stone collecting in the province of Guangxi?  IBC member Mr. Deng in Guangdong (the province immediately east of Guangxi) taught us much about stone enthusiasm in his area-- click HERE.  Mr. Jack Wong shared stellar information on the collecting of Lingbi stones in the province of Anhui-- click HERE.  As an IBC correspondent from Guangxi, we are extremely interested in your sharing.

Thanks for your thoughts and illustrations.

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Re: please give me some idea for the two stones

Post  riversoul on Tue Jul 08, 2014 1:44 am

Yes, Chris Cochrane, I would like to share information with all IBC members
Guangxi is the largest origin of suiseki and viewing stone in the world at moment, there are many information to share. My English is poor but I will do my best to do it in the future.
I think it is better to post a new topic about it, please pay attention to my next topic.

with regards

riversoul

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Re: please give me some idea for the two stones

Post  kevin stoeveken on Tue Jul 08, 2014 3:12 am

riversoul... very first picture evokes pure animalism.
a large hump backed hoofed mammal... bull buffalo bison bewildered beast

i dont know the rules of stone appreciation (if there are any)
but i do see what i see as being suggested by that and your other stones.

simply beautiful.
beautifully simple.

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Re: please give me some idea for the two stones

Post  riversoul on Thu Jul 24, 2014 4:45 am

I have made Dazai for these stones below






Also I compare my elephant nose stone with the photo of famous elephant nose mountain in Gui Lin, China, they look like similar below


Photo of famous elephant mountain in Gui Lin, China.


It is my elephant nose stone, how do you think it ?

Thanks and regards

riversoul

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Re: please give me some idea for the two stones

Post  dick benbow on Thu Jul 24, 2014 1:48 pm

I really like the workmanship on the elephant mountain stone daiza. I wonder if the feet were made a bit smaller and a third was added under the center arch of the stone? What do others think?

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Re: please give me some idea for the two stones

Post  Chris Cochrane on Sat Jul 26, 2014 3:44 pm

Hi Riversoul... These are very well-chosen stones and the fitted wood seats (Chinese style shizuo, which do not resemble Japanese style daiza) are fine.

Dick points out that in daiza-design, a landscape view stone typically is supported at outside edges where the landscape suggest support is needed-- where a weight bearing support or ridge reaches the ground and bears weight-- not (more simply) supported by broad feet at each end of a stone's length.  The daiza-design choice emphasizes the stone by keeping feet small.  Daiza-design also emphasizes the stone (as larger in mass than the seating)  by keeping the fitted wood seat at modest depth.

Dick specifically referred to your last image--arguably, an arched gateway stone.  For a daiza-style stand, this smaller fitted wood seat would be a typical alternative:



Note the four (4) yellow feet of modest size placed where the landscape feature bears weight at extended edges as well as ends on the stone's front side.

The daiza design is different than your shizuo design, but neither is inherently better than the other. Close fitting of the stone in its socket & the quality of wood used in the seating makes your seating a VERY GOOD option.

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Re: please give me some idea for the two stones

Post  riversoul on Sun Jul 27, 2014 1:33 pm

Many thanks dick and Chris suggestion.
I don't know make Daiza, I asked Professional Staff to make the few daizas for me.
Thank you again.

riversoul

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Re: please give me some idea for the two stones

Post  Guest on Sun Jul 27, 2014 2:25 pm

Hi Riversoul

Congratulations with having you stones in daizas....Chinese daizas for chinese stones  Smile ...

Kind regards Yvonne

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