Spring blackthorn installation

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Spring blackthorn installation

Post  Jeremy on Fri Apr 04, 2014 7:21 pm

My blackthorn.


IMG_7209 by urobeam, on Flickr

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Re: Spring blackthorn installation

Post  Guest on Tue Apr 08, 2014 11:26 am

Hi Jeremy

I like the display very much, very nice harmony....but would leave out the stand under the kusamono, as the slab, the tree is standing on is lover than this stand.

kind regards Yvonne

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Re: Spring blackthorn installation

Post  dick benbow on Tue Apr 08, 2014 5:06 pm

On the kusamono, my understanding is as long as it's height does not exceed the top of the main bonsai's pot. it's ok

Still a nicely done display, I have to say Smile

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Re: Spring blackthorn installation

Post  Jeremy on Tue Apr 08, 2014 5:33 pm

Yvonne Graubaek wrote:Hi Jeremy

I like the display very much, very nice harmony....but would leave out the stand under the kusamono, as the slab, the tree is standing on is lover than this stand.

kind regards Yvonne

Thank you Yvonne for your comments.
Would you suggest no stand at all for the accent?

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Re: Spring blackthorn installation

Post  Guest on Tue Apr 08, 2014 6:07 pm

Hi Jeremy

No stand will be elegant and perfect  Smile ...imho

Hi Dick

A kusamonostand taller than the bonsaistand is not something I would ever use.

kind regards Yvonne

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Re: Spring blackthorn installation

Post  Jeremy on Wed Apr 09, 2014 8:13 am

Yvonne Graubaek wrote:Hi Jeremy

No stand will be elegant and perfect  Smile ...imho

Hi Dick

A kusamonostand taller than the bonsaistand is not something I would ever use.

kind regards Yvonne

Hi Yvonne,
Thanks again for your input.

I am have a little difficulty understanding the reasons your "not something I would ever use." Why?
Are there rules / guidelines or an aesthetic we would all benefit for knowing and thus be in the know to make better decisions in the future?
My practices are evolving and any good advice is always appreciated. It is important to me I understand as much as I can, the why's and where for's, so I can authentically develop my practices and installations.

Yes nothing is ever perfect, yet in the moment created, it is the best I could do. In the future moments I strive to refine and get a little closer.

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Re: Spring blackthorn installation

Post  Jeremy on Wed Apr 09, 2014 8:29 am

dick benbow wrote:On the kusamono, my understanding is as long as it's height does not exceed the top of the main bonsai's pot. it's ok

Still a nicely done display, I have to say Smile

Thank you Dick for your comments.

On reflection, Yvonne's suggestion on the height of the stand bears some further thought. Striving for perfection can be a good discipline, yet at present, my practices holds imperfection as an important tenant of all my work and installations.
I wish to open the subject of displaying out. So many guidelines from so many directions and practices, it becomes very confusing when advice is given without an explanation offered as to why this is better. Is it tradition, personal preference or a particular school of thought? For me it is important to gather as much information to aid my personal journey, but good advice needs some level of explanation.

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Re: Spring blackthorn installation

Post  Guest on Wed Apr 09, 2014 10:32 am

Hi Jeremy

Are there rules / guidelines or an aesthetic?....yes and no...but the japanese have been around making installations years, before we even came around to think about trying to making a bonsai.

As far as I can see have the japanese, figured out what works, and higligt the trees in a japanese trad. installations in the best manner, when using japanese stands and pots...I am basicly talking about shohin here...it is easy to see when you visit a exhibition like Kofuku Ten in Tokyo.

I have seen a couple of non japanese displays....no japanese furniture... that works in europe ( Holland ) and resently a indonesian made a awesome difrent installation...Maybe Robert Steven will post hes friends photo here...., most of the installations witch are considered difrent in the western world, is still with the use of japanese furniture, but just displayed in a manner that often not highlight the trees in the best way, or are just wrong, in the attempt to do something else.

Your slab used for the maintree, the bonsai, is shallow without any legs...the kusamono is "only" the compagnion, and should be placed lower. As the bonsaistand have no legs, will " lower" be, without legs...and as the mainstand allready have no legs, will the kusamono be nice just placed on the table.

Talking about perfect, and not having the wish to be negative or picky...I was pleased with your intallation as it was, but would have prefered a bigger kusamono.

Kind regards Yvonne

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Re: Spring blackthorn installation

Post  Guest on Wed Apr 09, 2014 2:23 pm

Hi Jeremy

You can also use a even more flat little wooden plate for the kusamono...not a natural shaped, as this is what you already used for the tree..not a round, as both pots are round, but a Square, this is a shape not already used in our installation.

Again would I now prefer a Square pot for the kusamono, and this could be standing on a oval thin plate.

Kind regards Yvonne

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Re: Spring blackthorn installation

Post  Jeremy on Thu Apr 10, 2014 10:31 am

Yvonne Graubaek wrote:Hi Jeremy

You can also use a even more flat little wooden plate for the kusamono...not a natural shaped, as this is what you already used for the tree..not a round, as both pots are round, but a Square, this is a shape not already used in our installation.

Again would I now prefer a Square pot for the kusamono, and this could be standing on a oval thin plate.

Kind regards Yvonne
Thank you again Yvonne,
Your suggestions are most interesting and having done further research seem obvious now. Smile 

My personal approach for the journey  I am on relies on"stealing" the knowledge for many sources and using it within my practices. Taking what is of interest and further refines my taste, eye and pleasure.
My installations are not to everyone's taste, we all have different levels of appreciation, they are a moment in time that is true to me, my feelings and ideas. I only have one real guide and that is me. It is important to me my work is honest and reflects my appreciation, my taste and I understand as much as I can, not just blindly following a master, or what has come before, without a real understanding of why. I feel in this way an authentic expression is achieved. It to my mind is a revival of the best qualities of the past with my postmodern sensibilities. Scary thought. pale 

As a practicing artist, I look for inspiration form many sources and my own culture reflects within these works.
You mentioned in an earlier post, "guideline or an aesthetic, yes and no" Could you expand as I do not understand. Surely we all have some kind of stick to measure against? What ever you call it, I think naturally our own culture, experiences and personal preference must play a part in our level of appreciation.

I will in the future add the height and shape of stand into my thought processes. (I have in the past, but the refinement of the shape and height is an improvement, thank you.) To my mind, this is not just a Japanese concept, but a global one, where thing have a order of importance denoted by the position they command, (never being allowed to stand in the presents of a king, a raised dia for the most important person in the room, the high table, etc.).
I used the accent stand as it was the only one that I owned and I felt worked. I did try a few.
The accent pot is in fact not round, but a rustic free form and is not at all the same shape as the blackthorn pot. The picture is a little deceiving  I will be on the lookout for a few small thin slabs of varying shapes.

I look forwards to the next one. Very Happy 
Jeremy


Last edited by Jeremy on Fri Apr 11, 2014 7:23 am; edited 1 time in total

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Re: Spring blackthorn installation

Post  nekotoban on Fri Apr 11, 2014 6:50 am

This maybe first time I felt "Wabi-sabi" from an installation by a westerner.

Calm, simple, monotone but noble.  All three items make perfect harmony. I LIKE this installation very much.

To make it better, preferably use a flat little boad (we call it "ji-ita") for an accent palant .

Jeremy wrote:
I used the accent stand as it was the only one that I owned and I felt worked.

Jeremy

This is common problem to me, I have only few stands….and about your case, i think it worked too.

Thanks for sharing Smile 


nekotoban

P.S. The literati blackthorn is really impressive. It looks pretty old. How old?

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Re: Spring blackthorn installation

Post  Jeremy on Fri Apr 11, 2014 7:10 am

nekotoban wrote:This maybe first time I felt "Wabi-sabi" from an installation by a westerner.

Calm, simple, monotone but noble.  All three items make perfect harmony. I LIKE this installation very much.

To make it better, preferably use a flat little boad (we call it "ji-ita") for an accent palant .

Jeremy wrote:
I used the accent stand as it was the only one that I owned and I felt worked.

Jeremy

This is common problem to me, I have only few stands….and about your case, i think it worked too.

Thanks for sharing Smile 


nekotoban

P.S. The literati blackthorn is really impressive. It looks pretty old. How old?

Thank you nekotoban, your post has made me very happy. Like the sun has just come out. sunny 
Yours is my favourite comment to one of my posts, ever.
By the law of averages, I had to hit one eventually. Shocked cheers 

The blackthorn was collected in 1997. It was old then, but I do not know it's true age. Thank you for your interest.
My very best regards,
Jeremy

P.s.
I'm now off to look at your past posts and write glowing comments Very Happy 

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Re: Spring blackthorn installation

Post  Neli on Sat Apr 12, 2014 8:19 am

I love the movement and shape of your little tree. Enchanting!

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Re: Spring blackthorn installation

Post  Jeremy on Sat Apr 12, 2014 1:33 pm

Thank you Neli.

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Flowering

Post  Jeremy on Tue Apr 15, 2014 11:13 pm

Thought you might like to see it in flower.


IMG_7403 by urobeam, on Flickr

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Re: Spring blackthorn installation

Post  Neli on Wed Apr 16, 2014 5:26 am

I just love it....and wish it was mine.

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Re: Spring blackthorn installation

Post  Kakejiku on Wed Apr 16, 2014 9:01 am

Hi...thought I would chime in on the display.

First of all, I think it is very well done, and this is a display I can say the tree takes center stage and is quite distinguishable as the centerpiece of the display.

Now, I hope you think I am not nitpicking, but you said you want a frame of reference. I study a display system called Gaddou. It is easier for me to design a display on a step by step basis. This is by no means saying what you have done is wrong, or there are problems, below is just how I would judge it based on the criteria that Gaddou promotes.

In Gaddou, they use a formality system to rank each piece in the display. This is similar to other arts such as Calligraphy etc. The most formal pieces are called Shin真, the Semi-formal pieces are called Gyou行 and the Informal pieces are called Sou草. Definition of the display formality always starts with the tree. The tree is first defined by species and then by it's styling. So a flowering tree, is considered a Gyou (Semi-formal) and the Bunjin styling is classified as a Sou ranking. So this display would be categorized as a Gyou no Sou display.

With a tree that is Gyou no Sou, you would want to pair it with a pot that is round and glazed. Now I am not saying your unglazed round pot is incorrect, I actually quite like it, but with the Gaddou display, that is one point that may be brought up.

Secondly, in most cases I do not like your wooden kakemono that holds your shikishi. In this display, however, I think it goes well with the jiita that you have selected. Having some additional scrolls to switch out with different colors would be advantageous in the future. (Light greens, warm golds for spring, and some khaki/tans with cooler colors for Autumn may help you have more variety. Can you please tell me what the picture is...(it seems to me bamboo leaves, which would be an excellent spring theme) but I can not really tell.

Lastly, I agree with the others about the stand for the kusamono, but not because of it's height, it is because this would be a more formal piece, and it seems out of place with the informal styling of the tree. A small round jiita made from a wood native to your UK would probably fit best...I do not agree with the kusamono pot being square. Keep it as is, it is harmonious with the informal bunjin styling of the tree.

Anyways, hopefully that has been positive and constructive to help guide why I would change some of the things I made comments about, but on this display I think you really did an excellent job like some of the other posters have mentioned.

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Re: Spring blackthorn installation

Post  Jeremy on Wed Apr 16, 2014 11:16 am

Hi Jonathan,
Thank you for your clear and informative post.
My personal practice is to follow my feelings and taste. This will lead to some chaos and feelings of confusion. I do have consistencies, but I would rather allude to things I wish to express and allow the viewer to appreciate the installation at a level they feel comfortable.

Those trained and studying the ways of display will always feel things are not just so and that is fine by me. I will never please all the people who have a dedicated interest in the ways of display. It is very good you and others take the time to advise and suggest interesting and refining points to consider. Thank you for your input, long may they be offered.

Kakejiku wrote:Hi...thought I would chime in on the display.
….  in most cases I do not like your wooden kakemono that holds your shikishi. In this display, however, I think it goes well with the jiita that you have selected. Having some additional scrolls to switch out with different colors would be advantageous in the future. (Light greens, warm golds for spring, and some khaki/tans with cooler colors for Autumn may help you have more variety. Can you please tell me what the picture is...(it seems to me bamboo leaves, which would be an excellent spring theme) but I can not really tell.

Some japanese terms confuse me.
shikishi Is this just the name for paper, regardless of the shape? I thought I used tanzuk, the long thin cards. Am I way off?

I am trying not to use the traditional rolling scrolls, as the approach I take within my installations gives me limited space and certainly limited height at most shows. Finding scrolls that work is very difficult, whereas I can make tanzuk cards myself to suit the season.
Is that what you meant when you wrote, ?
Kakejiku wrote:Having some additional scrolls to switch out with different colors

Interesting aside I think, my daughter having read this said, he has spelt colour wrong.
Different cultures do thing slightly differently. You just got to select which way you practice your art /craft /passion.
Others, (In the fine art world of the west, refers to non western foreigners), and outsiders, (refers to those not trained or qualified in fine art, no matter how skilled they are), will not always appreciate your way. Yet there is no "way" in fine art, it is what the trained and qualified say it is at that moment, according to their traditions and practices. I try not to buy into such a limiting belief system.
Rules are for breaking, good aesthetics are global, we can all learn and feel, refine and develop. Not reinventing the wheel, but but allowing the wheel to roll freely where you wish it to go.  Suspect 
Do you thing, play and enjoy the ride is my philosophy, while stealing the knowledge and in time owning it.
Never stand still for too long, refine and evolve your practices.

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Re: Spring blackthorn installation

Post  Kakejiku on Wed Apr 16, 2014 4:58 pm

Jeremy wrote:
Some japanese terms confuse me.
shikishi Is this just the name for paper, regardless of the shape? I thought I used tanzuk, the long thin cards. Am I way off?

No you are not off, Tansaku丹作 is the specific name for this size of Hard Matte Cardboard like paper. I was just using the more generic term Shikishi色紙, which could encompass all these sizes of paper. Sorry for not being more precise in my word usage.

Jeremy wrote:I am trying not to use the traditional rolling scrolls, as the approach I take within my installations gives me limited space and certainly limited height at most shows. Finding scrolls that work is very difficult, whereas I can make tanzuk cards myself to suit the season.
Is that what you meant when you wrote, ?
Kakejiku wrote:Having some additional scrolls to switch out with different colors

Yes, I did mean having some traditional scrolls that roll as well. They do not have to be long, I have made solid color tansaku pieces that are proportionally correct that are only about 2 to 3 feet long...(1 meter or less)

Jeremy wrote:Interesting aside I think, my daughter having read this said, he has spelt colour wrong.


Yes, us Yankees sure have a different way of spelling, but I usually got 100% on my spelling tests in grade school. Laughing[/quote]


Last edited by Kakejiku on Wed Apr 16, 2014 5:00 pm; edited 1 time in total (Reason for editing : Quotes not correct)

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Re: Spring blackthorn installation

Post  robert nocher on Wed Apr 16, 2014 10:48 pm

Hi Jeremy

Excellent thread. I really love your blackthorn and this is a very interesting discussion on some of the more obscure aspects of bonsai display.

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Summer kakemono colour

Post  Jeremy on Sat Jun 28, 2014 10:12 pm

Kakejiku wrote:
Secondly, in most cases I do not like your wooden kakemono that holds your shikishi. In this display, however, I think it goes well with the jiita that you have selected. Having some additional scrolls to switch out with different colors would be advantageous in the future. (Light greens, warm golds for spring, and some khaki/tans with cooler colors for Autumn may help you have more.
Hi
I think it is unusual for displays to take place over the summer months, but in the UK there are a number of society shows throughout the summer month. So, what colour kakemono would be most suitable?

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Re: Spring blackthorn installation

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