6ft Japanese Larch suggestions

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Re: 6ft Japanese Larch suggestions

Post  Marty Weiser on Wed Mar 19, 2014 12:27 am

Arihato - Good point about leaving the terminal on the sacrifice branch. Peter Tea posted the same thing about trident maples. I also like your method of holding the tree in the basket.

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Re: 6ft Japanese Larch suggestions

Post  marc74 on Thu Mar 20, 2014 7:18 pm

ok sunday i will go with the operation.


I should try and take some cuttings 1st.  i have rooting gel, unsure how thick i have a chance of taking cutting from, smaller the better but would be nic to start a bigger branch off

any suggestions?




and many thanks again arihato for your great wisdom and input


thanks

marc74
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Re: 6ft Japanese Larch suggestions

Post  marc74 on Sun Mar 23, 2014 8:23 pm

ok, so here is the outcome




took some time to get through the roots and trim down enough

I didn't feel doing the V cut was an option with the tools and skill level I have

I managed to get some nebari showing and its not too bad for my 1st cut down
Just need to let it recover and grow well now and hopefully longer lower branches to eventually get some taper

at present the bottom branches will be sacrificial and I feel the right top needs to be dealt with somehow in future
the tree itself I feel is already at its ideal height.
let the top grow much longer so thickens up is prob the better option just unsure if should shorten to push energy down to the bottom needed area?

it is now in my shed out of weather but has access to light and will see if survives and how progresses


Ill report back


any future advise?

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Re: 6ft Japanese Larch suggestions

Post  marc74 on Mon Mar 24, 2014 2:01 pm

Just realised I made the cut at wrong place

should have been the next set down.

will reassess at weekend. Any advice for v cut?

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Re: 6ft Japanese Larch suggestions

Post  Marty Weiser on Mon Mar 24, 2014 2:12 pm

You could bend the new leader up and leave the top 2 branches for first half of the season to help promote strong root growth. Then cut the top out once the new leader has become more established - leaving a stub this year and then trimming it next spring.

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Re: 6ft Japanese Larch suggestions

Post  RKatzin on Thu Mar 27, 2014 12:27 am

Hi Marc, here's a couple of pics of a tree much like yours.

This is 2008 and when I got the tree the chop had already been done.



Here is the tree today after wiring up the new leader.



I realize after reading this post that I made a mistake in shortening my lower branches. I hope that by adopting the methods suggested I can get this going. I have potted it up at each repotting to this gro-box where it will stay for the next few years. Best of growing with yours, Rick

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Re: 6ft Japanese Larch suggestions

Post  marc74 on Thu Mar 27, 2014 8:39 am

Cool thanks for input


I'm going to leave tree now for 5 weeks and take to my bonsai workshop and maybe make the next cut then. I will discuss in the class etc

feel not wise to cut again so soon

I will report back and show some pics of the new trees I pick up

and then it's start on the bonsai bench project.

Smile

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Re: 6ft Japanese Larch suggestions

Post  marc74 on Sun Jun 29, 2014 6:16 pm

latest update




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Re: 6ft Japanese Larch suggestions

Post  marc74 on Mon Jul 07, 2014 10:05 pm

any further suggestions on growing on for the future?
ie should i be pinching certain growth out and leaving tips? or etc etc  let grow a bit wild for a season or two?




advise appreciated.  its growing on well, and lots of new shoots i just need advise on how to keep it under control and what to aim for etc


ty

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Re: 6ft Japanese Larch suggestions

Post  M. Frary on Tue Jul 08, 2014 1:05 am

Just let it grow for the rest of the year. Fertilize and water and sun. Next spring follow the instructions Arihato has laid out. He knows his larches just look at the pictures of his trees.
Which brings up a question for Arihato. Have you ever used American larch? And can European and Japanese larch be forced to backbud by defoliating like American larch. Also how cold hardy are European and Japanese larch. Just wondering because I see them in nurseries around here. I just walk out the back door and dig up American larches. Have 30 marked for collection next spring.

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Re: 6ft Japanese Larch suggestions

Post  arihato on Tue Jul 08, 2014 10:28 am

Yes I have used Larix laricina, it is not readily available here in Holland so I used the odd one I could lay my hands on. This is the only one I have at present, (from seed 2002)

IMG_3017 by Arihato, on Flickr

I find the internodes a bit longer than I would ideally like but that can be this individual tree and I grow them rather small.  Rolling Eyes 

Larix kaempferi and Larix europea are very hardy, in the ground down to -20°C, in pots the roots are a bit more tender. If they are offered in garden centres, they might be viable in your garden. If you want to work with really frost resistant Larches you could try Larix siberica or Larix gmelli, they are a bit more temperamental than L kaempferi.

About back budding, all I can say is that I have NO Larches that back bud on old wood. Larches in the wild have next to the twigs, on the trunk sleeping buds. But in growing them as ShoHin those are used and in my experience that's it.... It is the one drawback in growing Larches that you need to come to terms with, or you end up with only foliage at the end of the branches. I save the buds close to the trunk at all cost, they are my insurance to the future.
So if you are digging them, they may bud back once.
I would be curious to see photo evidence of defoliating and the subsequent back budding. I have in the 35 years I have been growing Larch never seen it, is all I can say. I would love to have a Larch that back buds, it would solve so many problems.

We, when growing Bonsai, are so spoiled with species that bud back on old wood, that working with a species that doesn't, took a fundamental rethink of my training strategies.

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Re: 6ft Japanese Larch suggestions

Post  M. Frary on Thu Jul 10, 2014 2:36 pm

Thank you for the reply Arihato. As soon as the growth on these things harden I have one that gets the needle plucking treatment. I'll take before and after photos and get them to you somehow. I like the little one you posted. In fact I like all the trees you put on here.
Thank you.
Mike Frary.

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Re: 6ft Japanese Larch suggestions

Post  AlainK on Wed Jul 16, 2014 10:21 am

Defoliating a larch is a very sure way to its death...

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Re: 6ft Japanese Larch suggestions

Post  M. Frary on Wed Jul 16, 2014 3:18 pm

AlainK wrote:Defoliating a larch is a very sure way to its death...
.

Maybe with the ones like European or Japanese larch but the American larch is possible to defoliate. You cut back the new shoots to 3 or 4 needles and pluck everything else off. In a couple weeks they push new buds and start growing like crazy again.

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Re: 6ft Japanese Larch suggestions

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