pot patina

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pot patina

Post  dick benbow on Fri Dec 13, 2013 11:56 pm

With the wicked weather spreading thu the U.S. like the plague, I decided to inventory my pots against those trees that needed to be repotted this spring.

My problem was finding those aged pots that matched with the aged trees. It seems I have more new or barely used pots. I also discovered my previous love of pines had my collection of mostly unglazed pots. Swithing Gears with a new interest in deciduous, I was loathe to find very few glazed pots, let alone any with patina.

So, getting to the point, is there any way to excellerate the process of creating patina, other then to pay one's dues over time. I know in most suiseki circles, use of waxes and other ingredients to add luster to a stone is not readily received. But some do it
expecially with waxes so that it can easily be removed after the show by dipping in hot water.

So back to patina on pots, any shortcuts whether acceptable or not Smile

dick benbow
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Re: pot patina

Post  arihato on Sat Dec 14, 2013 1:41 am

I had some stark grey pots, that were just too 'new'. I buried them in my compost heap for a season, it gave them a nice patina and got rid of the stark grey newness

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Re: pot patina

Post  dick benbow on Sat Dec 14, 2013 5:12 am

interesting...thanks for sharing Smile

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Re: pot patina

Post  rps on Sun Dec 15, 2013 5:18 am

arihato' advice is sound. also, just handle them a lot. 
and rub a VERY LIGHT coating of VERY LIGHT mineral oil on them once or twice a month (i use a few drops of sewing machine oil on a flannel rag). 

the oils from your hands ( or the flannel ) attract and hold the various 'dirt' particles we call patina.

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Re: pot patina

Post  JimLewis on Sun Dec 15, 2013 1:36 pm

I usually don't fret much about "patina" but I have aged a couple of them by burial from time to time. Seems to work.

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Re: pot patina

Post  Chris Cochrane on Thu Dec 19, 2013 4:10 pm

Dick wrote:I know in most suiseki circles, use of waxes and other ingredients to add luster to a stone is not readily received. But some do it
especially with waxes so that it can easily be removed after the show by dipping in hot water.

Such a rush to "beat" nature is often counterproductive.  On a stone, you'll never begin aging its skin to a natural translucence by adding wax & removing it. Each addition will leave a little oil (what waxes become when rubbed onto the stone) & the oil (attracting debris) will eventually obscure the stone's natural light refraction.  Hot water doesn't mix with wax/oil & remove it.  Instead it heats wax & stone creating more oil.  Once you start oiling, you have to continue adding a wetting agent to regain luster.  Once black stones of famous collectors (e.g., Bob Watson) are now brown & require a wetting agent to appear alive. The wax & dip stones will become brown, too.



Re' pot patina... If you seek to transform the entire surface of a pot, burial will accomplish glaze breakdown.  Perhaps, you can test to somewhat control it. I'd imagine leaf debris would provide a mildly acidic action in soil beneath it & soils leach minerals which may interact with glazes.  Glazes are modestly soluable and many contain reactive elements.  Pot burial will not create the wear of continued weathering & handling such as more worn/weathered rims & lower edges of pots used in bonsai practice... and it is natural patina through aged use that is desirable.  Most think the artificial aging (seen in production of many unglazed Japanese pots) is best avoided because of its artificiality.

My recollection is that one of IBC's resident pot experts (Ryan) noted in a previous thread that he thought light oiling of pot rims (occasionally) a good idea. I think Alan Walker was going to try it twice a month. I'd imagine the oil to make little difference except in preparing a pot for show.

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Re: pot patina

Post  dick benbow on Thu Dec 19, 2013 4:32 pm

Chris i always appreciate your sharing, thank-you!

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Re: pot patina

Post  arihato on Thu Dec 19, 2013 8:59 pm

Chris, I would never do this to a glazed pot or to a valuable (=old) one either (the burying I mean). I only do this to unglazed new pots to tone them down a bit. Natural patina, especially in porcelain can't be convincingly faked this way i think.

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Re: pot patina

Post  prestontolbert on Fri Dec 20, 2013 5:15 am

Someone pointed out not long ago that marble columns have a rich, dark, permanent patina right between waist and shoulder height. Obviously it is the result of constant rubbing with dirty, oily hands. Not obvious, though is the slightly porous nature of marble. Yixing and to a lesser extent Tokoname pots are somewhat porous and more easily patinate. Western pots are typically fired to a higher temperature and have a lower absorption rate making them not only more frost resistant, but potentially slower to gain patina. Also in asia sesame cakes are widely used to fertilize. Sesame oil is one of the few oils that dries to a thick, if sticky finish. I have been thinking about this for a time and I have been rubbing some of my pots with a light coating of linseed oil. Boiled linseed oil does eventually dry. If I ruin the surface of the pot, no big deal; I'll refire it. Laughing 
-PT

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Re: pot patina

Post  Russell Coker on Fri Dec 20, 2013 12:54 pm



Patina is very slow to happen when your pots are inside sitting on a shelf. Know what makes an excellent growing pot? An oversized bonsai pot. I have tons of pots... new, old, expensive, cheap, big, little and everything in between... and I use them and store them outside. Is the tree always worthy of the pot it's in? No, but who cares? That's not the point here.

My 2 cents.

R

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Re: pot patina

Post  Andrew Legg on Sat Dec 21, 2013 7:06 pm

Russell Coker wrote:

Patina is very slow to happen when your pots are inside sitting on a shelf.  Know what makes an excellent growing pot?  An oversized bonsai pot.  I have tons of pots... new, old, expensive, cheap, big, little and everything in between... and I use them and store them outside.  Is the tree always worthy of the pot it's in?  No, but who cares?  That's not the point here.

My 2 cents.

R

Hallelujah to that! I am often chastised for having my underdeveloped trees in show pots. Also for having unused pots on my benches amongst my trees. Oh well, I enjoy it and they age quicker. Well said Russell.

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Re: pot patina

Post  Guest on Sat Dec 21, 2013 8:29 pm

I also have very young trees in vintage big Tokoname pots  Cool...when the pot fits, does the tree have the right sice....I adore the old pots, and they make a young tree look better, while I wait for it to mature as bonsai.

Kind regards Yvonne

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Re: pot patina

Post  Russell Coker on Sun Dec 22, 2013 12:33 am

And I take better care to the trees too.

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