visit to Ryan Neil

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Re: visit to Ryan Neil

Post  my nellie on Mon Dec 10, 2012 10:50 pm

Sam Ogranaja wrote:Noone has said this yet, but if ... ... Happy Holidays everyone!!!!!
Sam
Sam, you've spoken my thoughts. Happy holidays to you, too!

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Re: visit to Ryan Neil

Post  Gary Swiech on Tue Dec 11, 2012 12:41 am

Thank you for posting and sharing these images of Ryan's work Walter.

I have followed his work on the internet and have never seen such a collection of American yamadori. And only in a few years!

His work reminds me of Dan Robinson's early work.

Randy Knight must have the youth and strength to collect these trees in Colorado, just as you have done in Europe, and the countless Japanese looking for the finest Shimpaku.

Ryan has the skill to transform them, and as far as his styling of these Bonsai I feel confident they will mature gracefully in his hands.

Like you said in and earlier post, wait another 10-20 years and see what cultivation in a pot does to them! They will gain the "Mochikomi" that was mentioned earlier.

Mochikomi

A standard term to refer to the years of cultivation of a bonsai tree. It means the years of cultivation as bonsai in a pot. For example, one expression is that '''Mochikomi' is old.'' This is a description of a bonsai tree that brews a sense of antiquity and rich taste on its trunks and branches after being grown in a pot for a long period of time. A bonsai tree that is cultivated in a pot for a long period will naturally have a sense of elegance. Its trunks and branches brew a sense of the traditional Japanese aesthetics of ''wabi'' and ''sabi.'' So, whether ''mochikomi'' is old or not will decide the value of the tree.


Thanks again for posting the images, it must have been something to see all of them in person.

Merry Christmas
Gary


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Re: visit to Ryan Neil

Post  drgonzo on Tue Dec 11, 2012 2:21 am

Gary Swiech wrote:
Randy Knight must have the youth and strength to collect these trees in Colorado,
Ryan has the skill to transform them,

And that folks is ultimately what we're seeing here. A beautiful partnership of raw material and the transformation of such into Bonsai..
put these two together and you're unstoppable!
-Jay

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Re: visit to Ryan Neil

Post  marcus watts on Tue Dec 11, 2012 6:58 am

i just hope the rest of the American bonsai community support and encourage Ryan - both verbally when due and financially as customers. This could be the turning point in the overall quality achieved by native trees, and to see up close refinement and detail performed properly will be invaluble for his customers.

support is the key - the English speaking world is eager for top end knowledge and these guys are in demand not only on home soil. In the UK we have Peter Warren offering a great service and fighting his own battle to improve national standards where possible, and in the UK soon we have a few days with Ryan too Very Happy. I think the key is to understand your assets and use them, because if not other nations will.

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Re: visit to Ryan Neil

Post  Sam Ogranaja on Tue Dec 11, 2012 2:30 pm

Thank you Alexandra.

marcus watts wrote: i just hope the rest of the American bonsai community support and encourage Ryan - both verbally when due and financially as customers. support is the key - the English speaking world is eager for top end knowledge and these guys are in demand not only on home soil.

Amen, Marcus. I think the US will. I know our club is communicating with him to get him here and I think what they're trying to do is arrange with multiple clubs to make it a big trip for him.

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Re: visit to Ryan Neil

Post  Vance Wood on Tue Dec 11, 2012 2:35 pm

Does anyone have Ryan's contact information? I believe we could have some business for him here in Michigan.

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Re: visit to Ryan Neil

Post  Jason Eider on Tue Dec 11, 2012 2:56 pm

yeah, just go to his website...there's contact info

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Re: visit to Ryan Neil

Post  Budi Sulistyo on Tue Dec 11, 2012 3:24 pm

Hi Walter,

You are really lucky visiting such a fantastic yamadori collectors. I could not imagine the beauty in the future. Thanks a lot for the wonderful sharing. Do you have any plan to visit Asia?
It was a great time to meet you in Switzerland last time.

Warm regards,
Budi

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Re: visit to Ryan Neil

Post  Walter Pall on Tue Dec 11, 2012 3:37 pm

The Artisans Cup of Portland from October 4 to 6, 2013 should be an excellent opportunity to see Ryan's garden. As I know him by now he will have another 30 to 50 trees styled in addition then.

See the great exhibit and also Ryan's garden and possibly a few other gardens as well. Get yourself a cheap flight soon!

Go find out more about this upcoming hostorical event:

Artisans Cup

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Re: visit to Ryan Neil

Post  Roger Snipes on Wed Dec 12, 2012 2:10 am

Thanks for posting the pictures Walter, Ryan has a truly impressive garden.

If people want to see Ryan in action they might also consider the Pacific Northwest Bonsai Convention in Spokane, WA next year, September 19 - 22, 2013. Ryan will be one of the Headliners, along with Robert Steven, Michael Hagedorn and David DeGroot. More information here: www.inlandbonsai.com

Ryan's workshop with collected Ponderosa pines is almost filled. He will also be doing two demos during the convention. It should be a fun event.

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Re: visit to Ryan Neil

Post  dorothy7774 on Wed Dec 12, 2012 2:54 am

Walter Pall wrote:

Just read about the tree development on Ryan's website. What a brilliant solution to a not so easy tree!

Try to "re-engineer" every tree Walter is showing in this thread and you will agree that design on this level reaches architectural dimension and goes beyond it. If you think you may just collect a yamadori and top it with some greens you are deadly wrong. So much more thought to it: What to eliminate, what to keep, risks, natural bends, drama. The greens keep the liveveins intact, liveveins give color and dimension where needed. The greens is only embracing the magnificent deadwood, that's the star, the age! Not the greens! What a tree..

Way to go, Ryan! The sky is the limit! And maybe not..

Best,
Dorothy

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Re: visit to Ryan Neil

Post  Jkd2572 on Wed Dec 12, 2012 4:19 am

Thanks Walter for posting. And thanks Ryan for taking bonsai to a new level here in the states.

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Re: visit to Ryan Neil

Post  Robert Steven on Wed Dec 12, 2012 11:26 am

Roger Snipes wrote:Thanks for posting the pictures Walter, Ryan has a truly impressive garden.

If people want to see Ryan in action they might also consider the Pacific Northwest Bonsai Convention in Spokane, WA next year, September 19 - 22, 2013. Ryan will be one of the Headliners, along with Robert Steven, Michael Hagedorn and David DeGroot. More information here: www.inlandbonsai.com

Ryan's workshop with collected Ponderosa pines is almost filled. He will also be doing two demos during the convention. It should be a fun event.

I didn't realize that Ryan will be there as well.. it would be great to meet Michael Hagedorn as well, I admire his works ! Thanks for the info Roger...

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Re: visit to Ryan Neil

Post  Walter Pall on Wed Dec 12, 2012 11:32 am

Robert,

Mike will be there as well, probably also Randy Knight.

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Re: visit to Ryan Neil

Post  Robert Steven on Wed Dec 12, 2012 12:02 pm

Walter Pall wrote:Robert,

Mike will be there as well, probably also Randy Knight.

Wow..hope you are coming as well, so we can celebrate your birthday there... drunken


Last edited by Robert Steven on Wed Dec 12, 2012 12:04 pm; edited 1 time in total (Reason for editing : mistype)

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Re: visit to Ryan Neil

Post  carlos on Wed Dec 12, 2012 12:14 pm

Mr. Pall,

Thanks for posting. With material like this one and by having an avid collector who can provide such wonderful pieces, it might not be as hard to build up a good collection in a short period of time. (by the way, i am not contesting the artist's technique in any way)

Another observation: Perharps I might be wrong (or maybe my age is not serving me right), but by looking at the pictures, the canopies of every tree seem to be identical. From my standpoint, I figure that such dynamic trunks require three dimensional branches. Each tree has sinuous movement, but the canopies seems static. To me, is like looking at two distinct elements; like looking at two different trees. I figure that those trees endured quite a few hardships prior to being lifted from the mountains. A perfectly shaped dome sitting on top on an otherwise incredible trunk seems a bit anomalous to me. The trunks might be different, but it is the same tree every time. Just my thought.

I have also seen the Mirai web site to see if i can identify some variations in the branch work. Basically, the same pattern is followed: 1) trunks are bent (sometimes with heavy bending); 2) Foliage is brought closer to the dead wood features; 3) Branches are wired and fanned out. I also saw some of the deciduous work, which is not as impressive. (material is not that good)

Again, Walter, thank for posting. It was great to see this. I hope Mr. Neil evolves his techinques to greater heights. Personally, I feel that Michael Hagendorn is better, but that's my choice cheers

Regards,

Carlos

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Re: visit to Ryan Neil

Post  Jishwa on Wed Dec 12, 2012 2:31 pm

Wow great photos and great work by Ryan. He is one of the few that I can stand watching and listening too without getting bored Sleep .

In regards to the seedling vs his selection of trees...I'm guessing although this is a lifestyle and a love for Ryan, it is also a business. How much do you think he could get for a 4 year old tree grown from seed vs what he is getting for those much larger trees...? It's that age old question artists must ask themselves, do I create what people want to buy or do I create what I want to create?...I have a feeling he has found the perfect medium between the two.

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Re: visit to Ryan Neil

Post  drgonzo on Wed Dec 12, 2012 4:12 pm

Jishwa wrote:it is also a business. How much do you think he could get for a 4 year old tree grown from seed vs what he is getting for those much larger trees...? It's that age old question artists must ask themselves, do I create what people want to buy or do I create what I want to create?...I have a feeling he has found the perfect medium between the two.

In Rochester this past summer I had the chance to meet Ryan. He brought with him about 6 or 7 trees from home and these were offered for sale at the national show. They weren't monsters by any means say in the roughly 2 ft range height wise. I don't think any were offered for less then $1000 if memory serves.

Ryan is obviously gearing his business (sales wise not teaching mind you) towards the more advanced enthusiast. Folks that have gone for some time in the hobby and are ready to make the commitment both time wise and financially to acquiring "world class" material as Walter sometimes phrases it. For those who seek out this sort of material Ryan is a God send. He recognizes that there is a market for this material and has stepped in to fill that niche. Not surprisingly by the end of the day on sunday, Ryan had sold all the trees he brought with him!

World class deciduous material is obviously not as readily available as the conifers Randy harvests from the wilds. The natural decision any business man would come to is the need to fill the shelves with product to offer for sale. Perhaps this may explain a bit of why we see the bulk of his nursery populated by conifers. Hopefully in time Ryan will expand into deciduous material further.

That would be very exciting.

-Jay






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Yamadori deciduous

Post  Al Polito on Wed Dec 12, 2012 6:43 pm

For that level and quantity of deciduous material to enter the market a few things would have to take place:

First, there would have to be more respect for deciduous material in the bonsai world. The trend is toward heavy-trunked, masculine "shin" trees that have immediate impact. Ancient junipers and pines command respect and dollars! I would wager the same is true wherever bonsai artists have conifers to work with. Wait, maybe not in China.

Secondly, more people would have to collect and grow deciduous. I'd wager it takes longer to create a world-class deciduous bonsai in most cases than it does a conifer. To develop the ramification is a game of discipline and patience, but the rewards are more profound: Show me something that takes me back to the oaken hillsides of Southern California or the Wine Country. Show me something that puts me in an alder forest alongside an Oregon river. One hears birds chirping, warm winds blowing, water rushing when a good deciduous bonsai is achieved.

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Re: visit to Ryan Neil

Post  Gary Swiech on Wed Dec 12, 2012 8:54 pm

I was thinking about this thread last night and thinking about how many species of dwarfed specimens of Juniper and Pine trees that could be collected

from the various areas in the Rocky mountains. Randy's harvests from the wilds, depending on where he is hunting, could host a wealth of trees.

There is not only Rocky Mountain Juniper (Juniperus scopulorum) and Western Juniper (Juniperus occidentalis) out there for the hunting,

but also the Utau Juniper (Juniperus osteosperma), Pinchot Juniper (Juniperus pincotii), Alligator juniper and even Common juniper (Juniperus communis).

That's not including the few Pine and Hemlock species out there in the west.

Randy must love to hunt for plants. I hope he finds the good one's and leaves the rest.

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Re: visit to Ryan Neil

Post  Halo on Wed Dec 12, 2012 9:09 pm

He is pretty good at this bonsai lark ain't he! Shocked

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Is Ryan a 'master'?

Post  eddieperth on Wed Dec 12, 2012 11:03 pm

Thanks for posting these pics Walter! They are inspiring! And I don't know if he is reading but thanks to you as well, Ryan!

I appreciate your desire to grow the art of bonsai outside of Japan. I have enjoyed your instruction and insight in the videos I've seen on the internet.

Now to my question in the title: Is Ryan a master?
I ask this question in all sincerity as a newcomer to bonsai. I hear him and others called 'masters', but didn't know if this is just a way of showing respect, or is it more official ala the martial arts. In the martial arts there are different levels of achievement (everyone is familiar with the coloured belts) that rise all the way to master, and ultimately, Grand Master.

Was just wondering if there are similar forms in Japanese bonsai or penjing?

I have no desire to derail this thread. What a magnificent garden! Hadn't noticed anyone else commenting on the setting. Portland is a beautiful area, and this garden has a beautiful backdrop. Like a magnificent painting with a wonderful frame! cheers

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Re: visit to Ryan Neil

Post  drgonzo on Wed Dec 12, 2012 11:26 pm

eddieperth wrote:
Now to my question in the title: Is Ryan a master?

The topic of what constitutes "master" has been discussed here.
http://ibonsaiclub.forumotion.com/t365-what-is-a-bonsai-master

I hope this thread can hopefully sidestep this previous discussion topic and remain focused on Ryans work and Walters photos.
-Jay

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Re: visit to Ryan Neil

Post  eddieperth on Wed Dec 12, 2012 11:34 pm

cheers for the thread drgonzo!! derailment successfully avoided....carry on with admiring these beautiful trees! thumbs up

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Re: visit to Ryan Neil

Post  Al Polito on Thu Dec 13, 2012 1:51 am

Gary Swiech wrote:

There is not only Rocky Mountain Juniper (Juniperus scopulorum) and Western Juniper (Juniperus occidentalis) out there for the hunting,

but also the Utau Juniper (Juniperus osteosperma), Pinchot Juniper (Juniperus pincotii), Alligator juniper and even Common juniper (Juniperus communis)...

Randy mostly goes for Ponderosa and Limber pines, Douglas-fir, Engelmann spruce and whatever junipers that look good... from what I can tell. He also grows a lot of other traditional trees, like Tridents and Japanese maples, but most of his stock is mentioned above. I've seen RMJ, Utah, Western and Common juniper at his place and not the others, but I've only been there a few times. I hear that before too long his business, Oregon Bonsai, will have a website up again soon.


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Re: visit to Ryan Neil

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