Knot pine style

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Re: Knot pine style

Post  Vance Wood on Wed Jan 23, 2013 10:01 pm

Absolutely right, why should we feel we have to justify our artistic efforts to anyone. If we enter something into a show or competition for consideration by a judge of some sort then we get what we get. Other than that, and as far as I am concerned, what any one thinks of my trees has about as much impact on my piece of mind as a beer fart in Bavaria.

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Re: Knot pine style

Post  MikeG on Wed Jan 23, 2013 10:52 pm

Beauty is in the eye of the beholder. Like I said earlier in this thread, this style isn't my cup of tea, but I truly appreciate the talent and horticultural skills behind it. The best thing about this tree is the discussion and feelings it's evoked. Isn't that how art (and most other subjects of thought) evolve? Paintings that were frowned upon 100 years ago are now displayed and studied as great works of art. I'm a realist fan and the limits of my own tastes reaches about the impressionist genre. But just because I don't personally enjoy abstract works of art, doesn't mean it shouldn't be enjoyed by others. How stale would life be if everyone agreed on everything. My best friends aren't people who think and act like me, but quite the opposite. Only thing we have in common is that we agree to disagree but freely express our opinions without judgement. Anyway, one of the best threads since I joined IBC. Got me thinking and friends of mine who don't enjoy anything to do with trees have liked it also.

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Re: Knot pine style

Post  AlainK on Fri Jan 25, 2013 12:58 am

Good evening ladies and gentlemen,

Hans van Meer. wrote:Or sometimes we just want to creat a thing of beauty or interest and our medium happens to be a tree or scrub!
It's to others to decide if we were successful or not!

OK with the first part of your statement.

Partly OK too with the second part: "It's to others to decide if..." :

-1- Do you mean a kind of demagrocy like clicking on a button like facebook's like/no like button? No analysis, no criticism, either black or white, in that case, this is the new standard for bonsai.

-2- What if I think that those who drool on technique and miss aesthetics are just like cult followers?

What's the point in twisting a branch into f***ing a trunk?

-3- "Go to the mountains, etc."

I was raised in the mountains. Instead of showing us a potted tree, show us a photo of the tree you pretend to have seen whose neck gets into its *ss... (Brit. "ar*e")

But maybe that's what you can see where you stay. Show us your pics, I can't afford visiting exotic countries, but I'd really like to, if only to see a tree eat out its... trunk.


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Re: Knot pine style

Post  Just Mike on Fri Jan 25, 2013 1:10 am

AlainK wrote:Good evening ladies and gentlemen,

Hans van Meer. wrote:Or sometimes we just want to creat a thing of beauty or interest and our medium happens to be a tree or scrub!
It's to others to decide if we were successful or not!

OK with the first part of your statement.

Partly OK too with the second part: "It's to others to decide if..." :

-1- Do you mean a kind of demagrocy like clicking on a button like facebook's like/no like button? No analysis, no criticism, either black or white, in that case, this is the new standard for bonsai.

-2- What if I think that those who drool on technique and miss aesthetics are just like cult followers?

What's the point in twisting a branch into f***ing a trunk?

-3- "Go to the mountains, etc."

I was raised in the mountains. Instead of showing us a potted tree, show us a photo of the tree you pretend to have seen whose neck gets into its *ss... (Brit. "ar*e")

But maybe that's what you can see where you stay. Show us your pics, I can't afford visiting exotic countries, but I'd really like to, if only to see a tree eat out its... trunk.


i think you missed the point he was making...he wasnt saying anything about making things black and white and no criticism and all that...he basically said "beauty is in the eye of the beholder" and it is the viewers choice as to weather they like it or not, and that just because some people do not like it doesnt mean others wont...

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Re: Knot pine style

Post  GaryWood on Fri Jan 25, 2013 3:01 am

Natural

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Re: Knot pine style

Post  Vance Wood on Fri Jan 25, 2013 3:16 am

AlainK wrote:Good evening ladies and gentlemen,

Hans van Meer. wrote:Or sometimes we just want to creat a thing of beauty or interest and our medium happens to be a tree or scrub!
It's to others to decide if we were successful or not!

OK with the first part of your statement.

Partly OK too with the second part: "It's to others to decide if..." :

-1- Do you mean a kind of demagrocy like clicking on a button like facebook's like/no like button? No analysis, no criticism, either black or white, in that case, this is the new standard for bonsai.

-2- What if I think that those who drool on technique and miss aesthetics are just like cult followers?

What's the point in twisting a branch into f***ing a trunk?

-3- "Go to the mountains, etc."

I was raised in the mountains. Instead of showing us a potted tree, show us a photo of the tree you pretend to have seen whose neck gets into its *ss... (Brit. "ar*e")

But maybe that's what you can see where you stay. Show us your pics, I can't afford visiting exotic countries, but I'd really like to, if only to see a tree eat out its... trunk.


So----------what do you think we all should do? Can you decide for us and show us the way?

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Re: Knot pine style

Post  Just Mike on Fri Jan 25, 2013 4:10 am

GaryWood wrote:Natural

that is beautifull....i wish my imagination and creativity level was a sgood as mother natures *sigh*

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Re: Knot pine style

Post  Velodog2 on Fri Jan 25, 2013 4:19 am

Actually this whole thread is making me kind of ill if only from the sanctimony of those who would presumably seriously consider the possibility that a turd on a dinner plate or statue of Jesus in a jar of urine might be beautiful, to someone.

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Re: Knot pine style

Post  Just Mike on Fri Jan 25, 2013 5:03 am

Velodog2 wrote:Actually this whole thread is making me kind of ill if only from the sanctimony of those who would presumably seriously consider the possibility that a turd on a dinner plate or statue of Jesus in a jar of urine might be beautiful, to someone.

again...missing the whole point...YOU dont have to think a turd on a dinner plate is beautifull because its not your turd...or your dinner plate...matter of fact, even the person whose turd and plate it is doesnt have to think it it is "beautifull"...not everything has to be beautifull to be appeciated in some way...sometimes you just look and say "wow, someone seriously took a dump on a plate...how strange is that?" just because you acknowledge the rarity and strangeness of it doesnt mean you will suddenly have the urge to start crapping on a bunch of dinner plates...

i just dont understand why this man's knot style pine bothers people when it isnt their knot or their pine and as far as i know the op never said anything along the lines of "this is what a beautifull pine shuld look like and you should all be doing knot style pines"...thats the part of the thread that is making me ill...


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Re: Knot pine style

Post  Velodog2 on Fri Jan 25, 2013 2:51 pm

Arrrgh ... words are clearly failing me and will be of no further use here.

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Re: Knot pine style

Post  Vance Wood on Fri Jan 25, 2013 6:06 pm

Velodog2 wrote:Arrrgh ... words are clearly failing me and will be of no further use here.

Maybe it is not the words that fail you but the spirt in them. You have by inference called this tree a turd on a plate and a crucifix in a bucket of wee, and those of us who think the tree worthy of consideration sanctimonious. I'm sure if some of us called you a narrow minded elitist you would be justifiably offended, so I will refrain from calling you a narrow minded elitist.

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Re: Knot pine style

Post  Just Mike on Fri Jan 25, 2013 6:52 pm

Vance Wood wrote:
Velodog2 wrote:Arrrgh ... words are clearly failing me and will be of no further use here.

Maybe it is not the words that fail you but the spirt in them. You have by inference called this tree a turd on a plate and a crucifix in a bucket of wee, and those of us who think the tree worthy of consideration sanctimonious. I'm sure if some of us called you a narrow minded elitist you would be justifiably offended, so I will refrain from calling you a narrow minded elitist.


yup...all this, plus the obvious irony of calling others sanctimonious while at the same time deonstrating the exact definition of the word...i dont know if it came out wrong or what, but what i read in your words was basically "i dont like this tree, and because of that i cant understand why anyone else would like this tree, and i should enlighten people with my superior vision by comparing this tree to a turd on a plate and a glass of piss...oh, and all of you who dont agree with me are obviously santimonious"...i mean, cmon man, you make it sound like Law should have emailed you for design approval eventhough your opinion or ideas on this tree ultimately mean about as much as the waste products you used to describe it...thats pretty much the deffinition of sanctimonious...not to mention incredibly rude.

to the OP: i like the tree, and i see where you are going with it and think it is coming along nicely...its also fun to see someone take a chance and step outside the norm, that often leads to the most interesting of subjects...im wondering, are you thinking about adding some shari?...i think a long shari would compliment and contrast well...thanks for sharing and please keep us updated.

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Re: Knot pine style

Post  Vance Wood on Fri Jan 25, 2013 7:41 pm

I agree, once the trunk starts to bulk up a bit more the image of the trunk will start to take on Yamadori qualities, which as I understand it, is a recognized style accepted for Yamadori trees that cannot or will not fit into the aforementioned classic styles.

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Re: Knot pine style

Post  marie1uk on Fri Jan 25, 2013 10:17 pm

The success of a tree is proportional to the interest it generates ... you do the math.

Will you remember this tree next year or the one that conforms to the 'rules'?


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Re: Knot pine style

Post  level320 on Sat Jan 26, 2013 7:21 pm

The success of a tree is proportional to the interest it generates ... you do the math.

Will you remember this tree next year or the one that conforms to the 'rules'?


well said marie thumbs up

regards
Ladi

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Re: Knot pine style

Post  will baddeley on Tue Jan 29, 2013 5:46 am

Personally I really admire this work. Not only is it a unique design but also a great show of technique, enabling the freedom of Laurant's imaginative concepts to be realised without compromise. Very Happy

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Re: Knot pine style

Post  Gary Swiech on Sat Mar 02, 2013 7:09 pm

I still like the tree and I believe it will become better with age. It already has a twisted trunk if you look at the bottom of the 1st photo.

Taking away the horticulture side, we try to create art and many artists have provoked strong responses from their viewers. This is unavoidable and the artist can either listen to the detractors or continue upon their path... Some people hated Picasso and Van Gogh could barely sell a painting in his lifetime.

Here are 2 images of an urban yamadori the first image is a couple years after collection, the other from last Fall. It's trunk is coiled but it was done by the nature of the plant over 30 some years, so that's how I styled it.








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Re: Knot pine style

Post  Gary Swiech on Sat Mar 02, 2013 7:19 pm

Here is the Fall picture.


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Re: Knot pine style

Post  Orion on Sat Mar 02, 2013 7:42 pm

Gary, very nice and interesting piece. I'd love to find local material like that.

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Re: Knot pine style

Post  Gary Swiech on Sat Mar 02, 2013 8:02 pm

Orion,

If you have one, I would call your local Parks and Recreation department to see if they are removing any plantings in
your town.

The one I have came from a planting of about 30 Procumbens nana in our town, unfortunately I didn't know they were replacing them.

I had a Landscaping business and came upon them when they were already dug by the City and were laying out on the sidewalk in the sun at 90ºF, 32.2ºC

and the roots were dry on most of them. I took the ones that looked like they had a chance, maybe 10 or so. This is the only one that made it back alive.

It only had a few green shoots appear on the tips of the branches and the way they bud back, I knew I it would live.

I found out from the City Records that these Procumbens nana were planted in the the ground in 1968. that makes this plant 40 some yrs. old.

I've had it in a pot since around 1998 or so.

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Re: Knot pine style

Post  Orion on Sat Mar 02, 2013 8:12 pm

Thanks loads for the tips Gary! I'll def. keep my eyes peeled esp. when the landscapers begin to appear.

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Re: Knot pine style

Post  AlainK on Tue Mar 05, 2013 3:23 pm

Once again, very interesting examples... of junipers.

If you wanted to prove once more that lots of coiled, twisted, contorted junipers can be found in nature, well done! Laughing

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Re: Knot pine style

Post  Emmy40 on Thu Mar 07, 2013 7:15 pm

Hello!

Law has no internet at the moment, he asked me to give you news of his tree.
Here it is today with its new pot...


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Re: Knot pine style

Post  Andrew Campbell on Tue Mar 12, 2013 6:47 pm

True art should cause commotion and discussion amongst other things. Personally I love this tree and the controversy it has caused. An excellent read and an even better tree.

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Re: Knot pine style

Post  AlainK on Thu Mar 14, 2013 6:22 pm

Hello Andrew,

Andrew Campbell wrote:
Personally I love this tree and the controversy it has caused.

µthen you won't mind my repeating that if I find it very intersting from a technical point of view, I still believe that it looks totally artificial, even more from this angle.

From "Burton" to "Bretzel" ?...

I very much prefer Laurent's Pinus unciniata. OK, I'm sooo traditional... Embarassed

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Re: Knot pine style

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