Alternates to Lime Sulfur

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Alternates to Lime Sulfur

Post  remist17 on Thu Sep 13, 2012 6:02 pm

I am curious to see if anyone can tell me other items to use than Lime sulfur to seal up Jins that are made. I am hoping someone has tried minwax sealer or hardner on their trees. I am looking for a product that can be purchased close in a hardware store.

Thanks

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Re: Alternates to Lime Sulfur

Post  Hoo on Thu Sep 13, 2012 7:06 pm

Are you looking to achieve the same color in the wood as you would using lime sulfur as well as preserve the wood? Or simply harden and preserve the dead wood?

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Re: Alternates to Lime Sulfur

Post  JimLewis on Thu Sep 13, 2012 7:46 pm

And lime sulfur doesn't "seal up" anything. It is a fungicide, so helps with temporary prevention of rot, and in the strength we use it on jin, it turns white after a day or two.

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Jim Lewis - lewisjk@windstream.net - Western NC - People, when Columbus discovered this country, it was plumb full of nuts and berries. And I'm right here to tell you the berries are just about all gone. Uncle Dave Macon, old-time country musician

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Re: Alternates to Lime Sulfur

Post  remist17 on Thu Sep 13, 2012 7:55 pm

I do not care so much on the color. I jsut would like something to put on the jin that are done. I dont think leaving them uncoated is ok... could be wrong.

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Re: Alternates to Lime Sulfur

Post  mike page on Thu Sep 13, 2012 7:58 pm

I only use limesulfer on dead wood that I want to have the bleached desert appearance such as California Junipers which are native to the Mojave Desert area in southern California.
For most other bonsai such as oak and olive, I use walnut oil that is vigorusly rubbed in. This will help preserve the wood and maintain a natural color. Walnut oil can be obtained at most art goods stores.

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Re: Alternates to Lime Sulfur

Post  Poink88 on Thu Sep 13, 2012 7:59 pm

As mentioned, lime sulfur and wood hardener do two different things so it really depends on what you want to accomplish. You can use one, or the other, or both.

The color change is a side effect of LS treatment, but you can also stain after if you wish (before you seal with WH).

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Re: Alternates to Lime Sulfur

Post  JudyB on Thu Sep 13, 2012 8:08 pm

When I was at Elandan Gardens a few weeks ago, Dan Robinson and Will Hiltz told me they use a product called Stop Rot. That's good enough recommendation for me!
Here is a link to a place that carries it. I don't have any yet, will probably need some next year, as some of my carving may be weathered enough for it by then.
http://woodworker.com/cure-rot-wood-restorer-mssu-78576.asp?gclid=CIHZl72fs7ICFcY-MgodLCIAtw

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Re: Alternates to Lime Sulfur

Post  remist17 on Thu Sep 13, 2012 8:37 pm

GREAT thanks to you all.
I understand a little better and I am sorry for explaining incorrectly. Stain and hardner works for me....

You are have been a great help with all my beginner questions.

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Re: Alternates to Lime Sulfur

Post  stagz on Fri Sep 14, 2012 12:39 am

if your willing to order a product, kaizen bonsai sells a dead wood preserver that doesnt whiten, only "seals" it

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Re: Alternates to Lime Sulfur

Post  Poink88 on Fri Sep 14, 2012 2:19 am

stagz wrote:if your willing to order a product, kaizen bonsai sells a dead wood preserver that doesnt whiten, only "seals" it
You are confusing wood sealer/hardener with lime sulfur. The wood hardeners here do not whiten as well.

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LIME SULFUR

Post  abcd on Fri Sep 14, 2012 6:13 am

To adjust the color, you can mix lime sulfur with water and china ink , the white color will be grey and more natural

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Re: Alternates to Lime Sulfur

Post  marcus watts on Fri Sep 14, 2012 6:47 am

hi,

going back to your original question - protection of jin............

If they are new freshly made jin they need a good few years of controled aging before you 'set' them and stop further rot or weathering. The beauty of lime sulphar is that the wood continues cracking, aging, weathering etc, but in a more controled way.

If you use a modern wood hardener it will penetrate soft rotten wood and set it, holding wood together that would otherwise fall apart - so not needed on many jin
If you use a modern wood sealer it aims to put a weatherproof coating on top of the existing wood surface, stopping future weathering, so defeating the desired effect

You clearly need to know what you are hoping to achieve and why, as newly worked wood does not look aged, has not cracked or weathered properly, and 99% of the time looks quite fake, so you would not want to 'set' and preserve this finish - There is no need to be in a hurry either - make the dead wood, and let it weather for as many years as it takes to look properly natural. You will get this weathering with LS on the wood, i dont know about oil rubs though, never used one.

its a case of using the right product but essentially at the right time, and on the right species - i have wood on a juniper and a yew that is several hundred years old and has survived this long without any sealers

cheers Marcus

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Re: Alternates to Lime Sulfur

Post  yamasuri on Fri Sep 14, 2012 11:19 am

Marcus,
Greatly put together. Make sence and you said it clear. I agree 100% Smile

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Re: Alternates to Lime Sulfur

Post  Sakaki on Fri Sep 14, 2012 11:56 am

Sometimes, I want to collect Marcus' posts, and publish a book Very Happy

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Re: Alternates to Lime Sulfur

Post  Eastern Bonsai on Fri Sep 14, 2012 12:50 pm

Below is a link I found for Lime Sulfur.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/320982459030

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Re: Alternates to Lime Sulfur

Post  marcus watts on Sat Sep 15, 2012 8:29 am

thanks Embarassed

haha....there are people sanding off sealers on new work as we speak. the key is expanding and shrinking the wood until it cracks, then expanding and shrinking the cracks to make them bigger and multiply. i'll get some pictures of my '4 seasons in one day' method very soon.

cheers Marcus

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Re: Alternates to Lime Sulfur

Post  Billy M. Rhodes on Sat Sep 15, 2012 12:02 pm

FYI, there was talk about lime sulfur not being available in the US, I was at a wholesale house in Apopka yesterday and they had cases of 12 Qt. bottles for $95, I didn't buy because I didn't know what I would do with the other 11 Qts.

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Re: Alternates to Lime Sulfur

Post  stagz on Sat Sep 15, 2012 11:31 pm

dario- no confusion with lime sulpher and wood preservers, im completely aware of the difference

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Re: Alternates to Lime Sulfur

Post  remist17 on Mon Sep 17, 2012 5:32 pm

Thanks all for the great talk.
I gave up over the weekend. I never thought wood hardner would be as hard to find as lime sulfur.

I bought to jars of lime sulfur today from a online store. IT will arrive in 5 to 10 days.....

sorry for the un-needed post but I learned from it.

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Re: Alternates to Lime Sulfur

Post  Billy M. Rhodes on Mon Sep 17, 2012 5:45 pm

I get the wood hardrner at my local ACE Hardware, it is made by a company known as Minwax.

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Re: Alternates to Lime Sulfur

Post  Poink88 on Mon Sep 17, 2012 7:03 pm

Next time check your pet supply stores for Lime Sulfur dip like this...
http://www.vetdepot.com/lime-sulfur-dip-16-oz.html
These are supposed to be concentrated (this is claimed to be 97.8% pure) so check the labels.

For wood hardener, check Lowe's or Home Depot. I have a thread about alternative options for it here
http://ibonsaiclub.forumotion.com/t11420-better-alternative-to-minwax-wood-hardener-wh
FYI, I will be trying the PC Petrifier soon.

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Re: Alternates to Lime Sulfur

Post  yamasuri on Mon Sep 17, 2012 7:50 pm

Hi all,
Talking about LSulfur what is your experience of quality brush using. I used to have set of "paint brushes" from $store but they dont last too long? Any resonable sugestion? Thanks.

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Re: Alternates to Lime Sulfur

Post  Poink88 on Mon Sep 17, 2012 7:55 pm

Have you tried old toothbrush?

I haven't used my LS yet so not sure if it will eat through it but I always have good results using old toothbrush on almost anything.

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Re: Alternates to Lime Sulfur

Post  yamasuri on Mon Sep 17, 2012 8:02 pm

Not I havent try t-brush yet Dario. However you need something pointing if the jin/shari is smaller? Toothbrush for large treatment- OK. Thanks

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Re: Alternates to Lime Sulfur

Post  Poink88 on Mon Sep 17, 2012 8:15 pm

yamasuri wrote:...you need something pointing if the jin/shari is smaller...
Yep, and that is when I will raid my daughter's craft (painting) supplies Twisted Evil

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Re: Alternates to Lime Sulfur

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