Ground or Container ?

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Ground or Container ?

Post  efishn on Fri Aug 31, 2012 8:37 pm

Hi all Ibc,

Just a "beginner question", or perhaps an old dilemma to all.... ?
as a beginner i'm purchasing these days (actually several months..) a lot of different trees. some of them need to thicken their trunk.
in this point i'm always wondering what to do, should i plant the tree in the ground (in my backyard..) or should i
plant it in big enough container with a modern soil. of course the goal is to thicken the trunk in short time.

what u guys say about it.. ?

thx






efishn
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Re: Ground or Container ?

Post  JimLewis on Fri Aug 31, 2012 8:50 pm

There is, of course, a third option: Buy bigger and better plants to begin with. There is no real way to know what a small plant will turn into when being grown out and many will turn out badly, though no fault of yours.

That said, field-grown plants grow faster and better than pot-grown plants. However, it is more difficult to do any preliminary styling on plants grown in the ground.

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Re: Ground or Container ?

Post  JudyB on Fri Aug 31, 2012 8:58 pm

As long as you can give the ground planted tree the same care that you'd give a training box plant, the ground tree will develop size faster. But I find that there is less control over my ground planted trees, I don't fertilize them as well, and the watering isn't as consistent... So for me training boxes are the way to go. Also if you have trees that are not hardy in your area, you'll need to have them in boxes or flats that you can move to protection in the winter, can't do that if they're ground planted.

Not trying to persuade you away from ground growing, all things being equal, it is the fastest route.

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Re: Ground or Container ?

Post  Kev Bailey on Fri Aug 31, 2012 10:41 pm

Just make certain that any trees that you are developing for thickness have their roots sorted before planting, in the ground or in boxes. If left as they came in containers, they will forever have horrible circling. This does mean doing the work at the right time, usually spring, as the buds swell.

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Re: Ground or Container ?

Post  Guest on Sat Sep 01, 2012 2:13 am

Put them in a pot and let the roots reach the soil. they will thicken fast at the same time you can work on the nebari without disturbing the feeder roots if needed be.

regards,
jun Smile

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Re: Ground or Container ?

Post  bonsai*john on Sat Sep 01, 2012 2:41 am

jun wrote:Put them in a pot and let the roots reach the soil. they will thicken fast at the same time you can work on the nebari without disturbing the feeder roots if needed be.

regards,
jun Smile


jun,

what do you mean by letting the roots reach the soil? does this mean that you have to put a big hole at the bottom of the pot, then bury it to the ground? please elaborate..


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Re: Ground or Container ?

Post  PeacefulAres on Sat Sep 01, 2012 11:50 am

Have you thought about using raised beds? It's the best of both worlds IMO.

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Re: Ground or Container ?

Post  efishn on Sat Sep 01, 2012 1:10 pm

PeacefulAres wrote:Have you thought about using raised beds? It's the best of both worlds IMO.


Hi,

can u explain please....

thx


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Re: Ground or Container ?

Post  Vega77 on Thu Sep 13, 2012 9:11 am

bonsai*john wrote:
jun wrote:Put them in a pot and let the roots reach the soil. they will thicken fast at the same time you can work on the nebari without disturbing the feeder roots if needed be.

regards,
jun Smile


jun,

what do you mean by letting the roots reach the soil? does this mean that you have to put a big hole at the bottom of the pot, then bury it to the ground? please elaborate..


He is referring to the escape method here. It's where you plant the tree in a box/pot/container, with drainage holes and place it on the ground and do not ever move the box. This allows the roots to grow through the drainage holes into the ground, thus accelerating the growth. Then when you are happy with the trunk, you simply cut the feeder roots that grew into the ground. But before you put it into the pot, make sure you spread out the roots evenly and radially.

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Re: Ground or Container ?

Post  Sakaki on Thu Sep 13, 2012 9:16 am

jun wrote:Put them in a pot and let the roots reach the soil. they will thicken fast at the same time you can work on the nebari without disturbing the feeder roots if needed be.

regards,
jun Smile

Like reverse-airlayering?

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Re: Ground or Container ?

Post  my nellie on Thu Sep 13, 2012 9:45 am

Vega77 wrote: ... ... It's where you plant the tree in a box/pot/container, with drainage holes and place it on the ground and do not ever move the box... ...
Or pond baskets. Even better.

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Re: Ground or Container ?

Post  Khaimraj Seepersad on Thu Sep 13, 2012 11:05 am

Use Google or please go to the library and start reading.

Colanders in raised beds of improved to a coarse soil state.

[1]
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/8/89/Hochbeet_Vorderm%C3%BChle_1.JPG/250px-Hochbeet_Vorderm%C3%BChle_1.JPG

[2]
http://images.taunton.com/enewsletters/vg/kg08-raised-beds-09.jpg

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Re: Ground or Container ?

Post  abcd on Thu Sep 13, 2012 12:12 pm

Clip and grow in ground is good for deciduous trees, a lot off fertilizers and water , but you will adjust the growth every year, move the tree, turn it and cut the long and big roots after 2 or 3 years , put the tree in pot after 5 years or 8 years , or , don't move the tree after 2 years, but air layering after 10 years to have a beautifull neabari.

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Re: Ground or Container ?

Post  efishn on Thu Sep 13, 2012 1:01 pm

Vega77 wrote:He is referring to the escape method here....................

Thank u Jun.

ThumbsUp

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Re: Ground or Container ?

Post  bucknbonsai on Thu Sep 13, 2012 11:19 pm

evergreengardenworks.com has an article about "why the ground is not like a grow box" that might have useful information. it always seemed to me that colenders and pond baskets are so small that they would not be effective in growing large trunks (yet Im trying to turn 4" trunks into 10" trunks) I have tried field growing and large grow boxes and the field wins every time. The trees are planted in pure compost that holds water well. I never give them any fertilizer and watered them about twice this summer, their growth is far more than ones in growing boxes getting water and fertilizer frequently. However one advantage of having them in boxes is that you can take them to workshops and club meetings for advise on training etc... I sometimes guy wire field grown branches to bricks laying on the ground. I will train all my branches at the same time as growing the trunk using multiple sacrifice branches coming off branches that I plan to keep and of course sacrifice branches off the trunk as well. Its always fun to pot up things but even in ideal sized grow boxes, the growth just is not as vigorous.

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Re: Ground or Container ?

Post  efishn on Fri Sep 14, 2012 1:13 pm

bucknbonsai wrote:evergreengardenworks.com ......

Thank u bucknbonsai ,

helpful very much.

Greetings
Efi

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